From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 2 04:16:02 1995 Date: Mon, 02 Oct 95 04:19:14 -0700 From: ADR Organization: Worldwide counterIntelligence Agency - W.I.A. X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.22 (Windows; I; 16bit) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Zilog, Inc. Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Message-Id: <9510020416.aa15156@ammi.mclink.it> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 164 Lines: 11 http://www.zilog.com/z80/z80.html Hi! Just to let you know (if you didn=B4t know already) that Zilog has a web-site with info on z80 processors! Cheers, Arne From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 6 12:36:00 1995 Message-Id: <199510061129.MAA12794@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: SAM Accelerator UPDATE: To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 6 Oct 1995 12:28:42 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 508 Lines: 18 Hi all... Just letting you know: Accelerator prototype phase 1: Completed Accelerator prototype phase 2: In progress Accelerator prototype phase 3: <-- Still awaiting hardware --> Accelerator prototype phases 4&5: To be announced. :) And if that's cryptic, I don't know what is :) See you all at the show I hope - and I should have AN ACCELERATOR PROTOTYPE with me, as put together and designed by the beautifully supple digits of one Martin Rookyard, as well as a lot of design input from me :) Simon From imc Fri Oct 6 12:38:18 1995 Subject: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 6 Oct 95 12:38:18 BST In-Reply-To: <199510061129.MAA12794@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no>; from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 6, 95 12:28 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 500 Lines: 10 On Fri, 6 Oct 1995 12:28:42 +0100 (BST), Simon Cooke said: > See you all at the show I hope - and I should have AN ACCELERATOR PROTOTYPE > with me, as put together and designed by the beautifully supple digits of one Martin > Rookyard, as well as a lot of design input from me :) Everyone must be back from their hols by now, so where are you? :-) Since the show is in just over a week, isn't it time for a discussion about who's going to be there and what identification they will have on?... imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 6 14:57:08 1995 Date: Fri, 6 Oct 1995 14:54:45 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510061354.AA12180@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: SAM Accelerator UPDATE: X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 631 Lines: 21 > Accelerator prototype phase 1: Completed > Accelerator prototype phase 2: In progress > Accelerator prototype phase 3: <-- Still awaiting hardware --> > Accelerator prototype phases 4&5: To be announced. > > :) > > And if that's cryptic, I don't know what is :) Hum..hum...you need 5 prototypes to finish. If that's not overkill, I don't know what is. ;) > > See you all at the show I hope - and I should have AN ACCELERATOR PROTOTYPE > with me, as put together and designed by the beautifully supple digits of one Martin > Rookyard, as well as a lot of design input from me :) I wish I could have been there.... -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 6 15:13:33 1995 Date: Fri, 06 Oct 1995 14:44:32 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <10960@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Sam show X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 57 Lines: 6 Hols? Whats those then? Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 6 15:42:12 1995 From: Tim Paveley Message-Id: <12468.9510061418@titian.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Subject: Re: SAM Accelerator UPDATE: To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 6 Oct 1995 15:18:42 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <9510061354.AA12180@asmal.edh-net> from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 6, 95 02:54:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 655 Lines: 20 To Quote Frode Tenneboe : > > Accelerator prototype phase 1: Completed > > Accelerator prototype phase 2: In progress > > Accelerator prototype phase 3: <-- Still awaiting hardware --> > > Accelerator prototype phases 4&5: To be announced. > > See you all at the show I hope - and I should have AN ACCELERATOR PROTOTYPE > > with me, as put together and designed by the beautifully supple digits of one Martin > > Rookyard, as well as a lot of design input from me :) etc Damn, I wish I hadn't unsubbed from this list over the summer. :-) ....@/ -- Tim Paveley - University of Southampton Sam Coupe Web Pages: http://whig.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~tsp93/Coupe/ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 6 17:03:28 1995 Date: Fri, 6 Oct 1995 17:00:28 +0100 (BST) From: Steve Taylor X-Sender: sct1000@blue.csi.cam.ac.uk To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: SAM Accelerator UPDATE: In-Reply-To: <12468.9510061418@titian.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 465 Lines: 14 On Fri, 6 Oct 1995, Tim Paveley wrote: > Damn, I wish I hadn't unsubbed from this list over the summer. > You didn't miss anything... +--------------------------------------------------------------+ | Steve Taylor sct1000@cam.ac.uk | | Pembroke College http://nikita.pem.cam.ac.uk/sct1000/ | | Cambridge CB2 1RF | +--------------------------------------------------------------+ From imc Fri Oct 6 18:04:16 1995 Subject: Re: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 6 Oct 95 18:04:16 BST In-Reply-To: <10960@bgserv.demon.co.uk>; from "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." at Oct 6, 95 2:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 145 Lines: 6 On Fri, 06 Oct 1995 14:44:32 GMT, Brian Gaff Sam Dept. said: > Hols? Whats those then? I don't know but some people seem to have had some. imc From sam-users-owner@no.unit.nvg Fri Oct 6 19:35:53 1995 Date: Fri, 6 Oct 95 15:13:26 PDT From: Stefan Drissen Subject: RE: Sam show To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg X-Mailer: Chameleon - TCP/IP for Windows by NetManage, Inc. Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg Status: RO Content-Length: 1339 Lines: 33 To parrot Ian, >Everyone must be back from their hols by now, so where are you? :-) >Since the show is in just over a week, isn't it time for a discussion about >who's going to be there and what identification they will have on?... Well, I'll be there with Martijn Groen. You should all be able to recognize me from the scanned photo on FRED 58. I /MAY/ be wearing the SF cap (as in Solar Flare, or should that be San Francisco 49ers?) and the starry shirt but I may decide on a somewhat more subtle dress code. I also /MAY/ be hanging some SAMdacs around my neck, I /WILL/ be bringing 10 or so SAMdacs along to the show, so remember to bring that extra 25 pounds if you want one. I will of course also be bringing along the amazing SAM MOD player (at version 2.03 at the moment) so that you can all purchase a copy for a mere 5 pounds. If you've already got a copy, bring it along and I'll give you a free update. BTW It has been VERY, VERY, VERY, VERY, VERY (I think I've proved my point) quiet these last few weeks. The only big surge we've had has been on the file type discussion. Who's got a contreversial subject up their sleeves? That's all folks, Stefan Drissen aka Solar Flare of Entropy E-mail: drissen@pi.net S-mail: Zevende Herven 6, 5232 JZ 's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands T-mail: +31-73-414969 From sam-users-owner@no.unit.nvg Sat Oct 7 02:01:24 1995 Message-Id: <199510070101.CAA28745@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Accelerator... Phase 2 complete To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg Date: Sat, 7 Oct 1995 02:01:46 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@uk.ac.mcc.nessie (Simon Cooke) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg Status: RO Content-Length: 453 Lines: 15 Hiya... can't see this properly (using Termite... not got all the ANSI codes in yet... well, not the ones that'll let me use the JOE editor anyway) Okay... the accelerator is up to phase 3 now... still another 128k to be put on the board (we now have the world's only 128k sam), and it's running at 8MHZ with a few glitches... Any demos involving border scrollies fall over quite unremittingly ;) More comprehensive postings later... Byee! Simon From sam-users-owner@no.unit.nvg Sat Oct 7 10:01:10 1995 From: Tim Paveley Message-Id: <17098.9510070859@titian.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Subject: The Show To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg (sam-users mailing lsit) Date: Sat, 7 Oct 1995 09:59:58 +0100 (BST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Reply-To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg Status: RO Content-Length: 365 Lines: 14 Hi! Yeah, I'll be there, I might wear the "Lock up your snails" T-Shirt again, and I might even do one of those nice little name card things, but I dunno about that. You won't recognise me from the photo in FRED, I got chopped of the end :-( Tim ....@/ -- Tim Paveley - University of Southampton Sam Coupe Web Pages: http://whig.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~tsp93/Coupe/ From sam-users-owner@no.unit.nvg Mon Oct 9 00:58:35 1995 Message-Id: From: geoffw@uk.ac.york.cs.minster (Geoff Winkless) Date: Mon, 9 Oct 1995 00:58:34 +0100 X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg Subject: hello again... Reply-To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg Status: RO Content-Length: 641 Lines: 22 Well, I could finally be bothered to resubscribe to this list... Just a niggling thing... I was looking at Tim's FAQ and stuff for the SAM and expecting to be mentioned in at least _one_ place (of Sam people, Sam software or Sam PD) and none of them mentioned my existence!!! Sorry if everyone thinks I'm not worth a few bytes on a server, but personally I found it extremely upsetting... *bursts into tears* ;-) Anyone else up at this ridiculous hour? What's been going on recently? I take it there's a Format fair soon? I should be able to go this time, since the Acorn show is on 27th... PS Anyone want to give me a job? ;-) -- From sam-users-owner@no.unit.nvg Mon Oct 9 09:19:29 1995 From: Tim Paveley Message-Id: <28671.9510090816@titian.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Subject: Re: hello again (fwd) To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg (sam-users mailing lsit) Date: Mon, 9 Oct 1995 09:16:14 +0100 (BST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Reply-To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg Status: RO Content-Length: 1616 Lines: 48 Sorry to reply over the mailing list. I did try to extract the email address from the header, but obviously got part of it wrong coz it came back user unknown...... ....@/ To Quote Geoff Winkless : > Just a niggling thing... I was looking at Tim's FAQ and stuff for the > SAM and expecting to be mentioned in at least _one_ place (of Sam people, > Sam software or Sam PD) and none of them mentioned my existence!!! > > Sorry if everyone thinks I'm not worth a few bytes on a server, but > personally I found it extremely upsetting... > > *bursts into tears* > > ;-) Hi Geoff, You can blame the FAQ bit on Graham Goring, since he was doing that, though now he's lost net access I'm not too sure what to do with it. However I don't mind putting anything else you care to send me up. ie An Address, Price List, etc. If you want I'll add your name into the email contacts list. The main problem is that I lose track of whats happening, so if people don't point these sorts of things out to me, then I never get around to updating anything. Like I say, tell me what you want me to add, and I'll do it when I next have 5minutes or so to spare :-) > Anyone else up at this ridiculous hour? What's been going on recently? I take > it there's a Format fair soon? I should be able to go this time, since > the Acorn show is on 27th... Next Gloucester Show is the 14th of October from what I recall. No doubt someone will have replied to that question via the mailing list anyway! Regards. Tim ....@/ -- Tim Paveley - University of Southampton Sam Coupe Web Pages: http://whig.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~tsp93/Coupe/ From imc Mon Oct 9 10:53:23 1995 Subject: Re: hello again... To: sam-users@no.unit.nvg Date: Mon, 9 Oct 95 10:53:23 BST In-Reply-To: ; from "Geoff Winkless" at Oct 9, 95 12:58 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 386 Lines: 12 On Mon, 9 Oct 1995 00:58:34 +0100, Geoff Winkless said: > Anyone else up at this ridiculous hour? What's been going on recently? I take > it there's a Format fair soon? I should be able to go this time, since > the Acorn show is on 27th... The show is THIS SATURDAY. > PS Anyone want to give me a job? ;-) Could you just pop over to Sainsbury's as I forgot to get some pasta... imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 9 13:01:19 1995 Message-Id: From: Andrew M Gale Subject: subscribe To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Mon, 9 Oct 1995 12:58:40 +0100 (BST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 34 Lines: 2 SUBSCRIBE ee31ag@ee.surrey.ac.uk From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 11:27:23 1995 Message-Id: <199510101024.LAA01756@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 11:23:55 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510061138.AA07202@boothp1.ecs.ox.ac.uk> from "Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk" at Oct 6, 95 12:38:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 469 Lines: 17 Hi Ian, > Everyone must be back from their hols by now, so where are you? :-) > Since the show is in just over a week, isn't it time for a discussion about > who's going to be there and what identification they will have on?... > > imc Weeeelllll..... I was thinking of perhaps bringing along the hat again, so that's an easy identifier if I ever saw one. Mebbe a big scrawled badge saying "COOOKIE!" on the front too... sticky labels, don'tcha love em? :) Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 11:28:00 1995 Message-Id: <199510101026.LAA01769@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: SAM Accelerator UPDATE: To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 11:26:08 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510061354.AA12180@asmal.edh-net> from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 6, 95 02:54:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 462 Lines: 16 > > And if that's cryptic, I don't know what is :) > > Hum..hum...you need 5 prototypes to finish. weellll... they mostly go on the same board (a piece of stripboard about a foot long, nearly totally covered in chips atm)... and we're up to version 2 now, version 3 as soon as we get the socket. BTW: the 8Mhz accelerator is nearly the slowest one we could make... honest! [show] > I wish I could have been there.... Yeah.. it would have been cool. SImon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 11:32:58 1995 Message-Id: <199510101031.LAA01797@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: hello again... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 11:31:17 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: from "Geoff Winkless" at Oct 9, 95 00:58:34 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 407 Lines: 12 > Anyone else up at this ridiculous hour? What's been going on recently? I take > it there's a Format fair soon? I should be able to go this time, since > the Acorn show is on 27th... Exceelllleeeeent!!!!! :) Geoff, please allow me to buy you a pint of something at the show :) (same goes for Stefan... shouldn't be going by train this time y'see) BTW: your border scrollies don't work at 8Mhz :) Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 11:33:09 1995 Message-Id: <199510101031.LAA01790@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 11:29:44 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: from "Stefan Drissen" at Oct 6, 95 03:13:26 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1523 Lines: 33 > Well, I'll be there with Martijn Groen. You should all be able to recognize > me from the scanned photo on FRED 58. I /MAY/ be wearing the SF cap (as in > Solar Flare, or should that be San Francisco 49ers?) and the starry shirt but > I may decide on a somewhat more subtle dress code. I also /MAY/ be hanging > some SAMdacs around my neck, I /WILL/ be bringing 10 or so SAMdacs along to > the show, so remember to bring that extra 25 pounds if you want one. *grins* Why be subtle when you can be outrageous? ;) > I will of course also be bringing along the amazing SAM MOD player (at > version 2.03 at the moment) so that you can all purchase a copy for a mere 5 > pounds. If you've already got a copy, bring it along and I'll give you a > free update. I think I've got the latest one :) But may I recommend EVERYONE reading to get a copy? Also: I should be bringing some excellent mods to blare out of the Quazar :) Should be good! Stefan: ever thought of writing a version of the Modplayer to run on a dedicated 18MHz board with 1Mb of memory? :) :) :) CPG: Quazar upgrade based on the same? ^^^^^ > BTW It has been VERY, VERY, VERY, VERY, VERY (I think I've proved my point) > quiet these last few weeks. The only big surge we've had has been on the > file type discussion. Who's got a contreversial subject up their sleeves? Bob Brenchley.. erm... possibly :) I'm waiting for someone to ask me at the show "If it's an accelerator, how come it takes so long to load fromt he disk?" :) Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 11:37:49 1995 Message-Id: <199510101036.LAA01844@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Speed trials on the accelerator (v2) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 11:36:38 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1250 Lines: 43 HI All... Some speed trials: 1) Very early demo version of lemmings... Tested with 40 lemmings onscreen. Average speeds: Normal sam: 15 frames per update 6MHz accelerated: 13 Frames per update 8Mhz accelerated: 11 Frames per update 2) Prince of Persia Normal (ie not the upside-down level) gameplay Average speeds: Normal sam: 4 frames or so per update 8Mhz accelerated: 1 frame per update (and unplayable because of it! :) ) 3) Border scrollers Tend to on average take about 1/2 the time to run... block size still a minimum of 16 pixels, with the possibility of an offset of 8 pixels (ie no change there), but all the delays are screwed up, so it takes up 1/2 the screen size. 4) Basic programs Lots nicer on the whole... Basically, see it at the show... and remember: the release version should run at 18Mhz (if you go for the cheapo one). Interesting facts found out during development: 1) NMOS Z80's output 0 when you do ED 71 (the undocumented OUT (C),0 instruction) 2) CMOS Z80's output &FF when you do the same... good way of determining what type you're using? 3) Z380's ... well... that'd be telling... 4) The ASIC seems to be able to manage asynchronous IOs perfectly well... which is surprising to say the least. Byee! Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 11:39:03 1995 Message-Id: <199510101038.LAA01859@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: hello again... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 11:37:40 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510090953.AA08215@client34.comlab.ox.ac.uk> from "Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk" at Oct 9, 95 10:53:23 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 375 Lines: 14 > On Mon, 9 Oct 1995 00:58:34 +0100, Geoff Winkless said: > > Anyone else up at this ridiculous hour? What's been going on recently? I take > > it there's a Format fair soon? I should be able to go this time, since > > the Acorn show is on 27th... > > The show is THIS SATURDAY. That is, to add to what Ian's just said: the 14th of October... Just to make sure :) Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 12:13:55 1995 Message-Id: <2279.199510101037@lenzie.cent.gla.ac.uk> From: William Easson <9264201e@udcf.gla.ac.uk> Subject: Re: SAM Accelerator UPDATE: To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 11:37:43 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <199510101026.LAA01769@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 10, 95 11:26:08 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 307 Lines: 13 > BTW: the 8Mhz accelerator is nearly the slowest one we could make... honest! Why are you slowing an accelerator down? -- Yours, William E B Easson E-Mail: 9264201e@udcf.gla.ac.uk WWW: http://www.gla.ac.uk/Clubs/WebSoc/members/9264201e/will.html and: http://www.gla.ac.uk/Clubs/GUVZS/guvzs.html From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 12:30:07 1995 Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 12:28:27 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510101128.AA17297@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Speed trials on the accelerator (v2) X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 969 Lines: 34 > HI All... > > Some speed trials: [showing off delted :] > Basically, see it at the show... and remember: the release version should > run at 18Mhz (if you go for the cheapo one). I asume that you can turn it off?! > > Interesting facts found out during development: > > 1) NMOS Z80's output 0 when you do ED 71 (the undocumented OUT (C),0 > instruction) > 2) CMOS Z80's output &FF when you do the same... good way of determining > what type you're using? Well, if it is undocumented you never know what the future brings. But my guess is that you get the result you get because the NMOS probably 'pulls' the databus up, whilce CMOS 'pulls' it down in order to make something readable. The instruction does not actually generate anything. > 3) Z380's ... well... that'd be telling... What about ARM? :) > 4) The ASIC seems to be able to manage asynchronous IOs perfectly well... > which is surprising to say the least. Does Brucey know about this? -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 12:40:19 1995 Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 12:31:13 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510101131.AA17300@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Sam show X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 262 Lines: 12 > Bob Brenchley.. erm... possibly :) What about him? :) > > I'm waiting for someone to ask me at the show "If it's an accelerator, how > come it takes so long to load fromt he disk?" :) "But it allows you to type 'LOAD "megademo"' much faster." :) -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 14:35:22 1995 Message-Id: <199510101334.OAA04054@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Speed trials on the accelerator (v2) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 14:32:18 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510101128.AA17297@asmal.edh-net> from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 10, 95 12:28:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1519 Lines: 44 > > Basically, see it at the show... and remember: the release version should > > run at 18Mhz (if you go for the cheapo one). > > I asume that you can turn it off?! Ummm.... the easiest way to do that is to remove it from the back of the machine. We've also got a couple of other problems - programs which rely on the R register for a random number generator, for example, won't work any more :( We're working on it - remember, this is just the protoprototype :) > > > > Interesting facts found out during development: > > > > 1) NMOS Z80's output 0 when you do ED 71 (the undocumented OUT (C),0 > > instruction) > > 2) CMOS Z80's output &FF when you do the same... good way of determining > > what type you're using? > > Well, if it is undocumented you never know what the future brings. > But my guess is that you get the result you get because the NMOS > probably 'pulls' the databus up, whilce CMOS 'pulls' it down > in order to make something readable. The instruction does not > actually generate anything. Surely the other way around? Actually, on the Z380 that instruction takes another operand, so you get OUT (C),n (format: ED 71 nn) > > 3) Z380's ... well... that'd be telling... > > What about ARM? :) Wellll... we'll see :) > > 4) The ASIC seems to be able to manage asynchronous IOs perfectly well... > > which is surprising to say the least. > > Does Brucey know about this? Not yet, but then, cadging his phone number out of Chris White is like pulling teeth without anaesthetic. Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 14:36:23 1995 Message-Id: <199510101335.OAA04083@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: SAM Accelerator UPDATE: To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 14:34:54 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <2279.199510101037@lenzie.cent.gla.ac.uk> from "William Easson" at Oct 10, 95 11:37:43 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 403 Lines: 13 > > > BTW: the 8Mhz accelerator is nearly the slowest one we could make... honest! > > Why are you slowing an accelerator down? Namely because we can't get a socket for the faster chip yet... :) Okay, so we could have done a 3Mhz one, but that would have been stupid, to put it mildly :) The finished one will run at a minimum of 18MHz, dropping to 6 (through wait states) for some things... Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 14:56:30 1995 Message-Id: From: Andrew M Gale Subject: Re: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 14:37:32 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <199510101024.LAA01756@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 10, 95 11:23:55 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 313 Lines: 8 Having just re-subscribed to the SAM list after the hols, I seem to have missed all the hype about the accelerator. Is it just a fast processor that's slowed down for memory & io accesses, or is it a fast processor with 512K of fast ram mimicing the SAM's RAM for reads? (but not writes). Please tell all! -Andy From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 15:30:00 1995 Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 15:19:40 PDT From: Stefan Drissen Subject: Re: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no X-Mailer: Chameleon - TCP/IP for Windows by NetManage, Inc. Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1794 Lines: 48 >*grins* Why be subtle when you can be outrageous? ;) Because when everybody is being outrageous it is outrageous to be subtle. ;) >I think I've got the latest one :) But may I recommend EVERYONE reading to >get a copy? Also: I should be bringing some excellent mods to blare out of >the Quazar :) Should be good! You've actually got version 2.02 Simon. I think my Jogeir Liljedahl mods are the best (IMHO) and I'll be bringing along some nice Escom 80 watt speakers to attach to a nice SAMdac to blare them out. If I can't borrow somebody's SAM for this I'll buy one at the show! >Stefan: ever thought of writing a version of the Modplayer to run on a >dedicated 18MHz board with 1Mb of memory? :) :) :) I would, if I had both. Since I still haven't got the 1mb I can't write a 1mb version of the player (I'm still waiting for WC to give me one, after all it's brilliant advertising). I must say that I would love to write a mod player for the 18MHz board, let me see.... 8 channel mods should be really easy, 16 channel mods would require some extra coding for the extra commands implemented by the "other" trackers and the sample frequency should be able to improve - my fingers are itching. >CPG: Quazar upgrade based on the same? ^^^^^ Problem is, the MOD player supplied with the Quazar is a crippled Quazar only version of my MOD player. So I'd like to see Colin do his best. ;) >Bob Brenchley.. erm... possibly :) Who's he? ;) >I'm waiting for someone to ask me at the show "If it's an accelerator, how >come it takes so long to load fromt he disk?" :) Because it's still using the same monitor? Stefan Drissen aka Solar Flare of Entropy E-mail: drissen@pi.net S-mail: Zevende Herven 6, 5232 JZ 's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands T-mail: +31-73-414969 From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 15:40:00 1995 Message-Id: <199510101438.PAA04781@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 15:37:34 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: from "Andrew M Gale" at Oct 10, 95 02:37:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 629 Lines: 15 > > Having just re-subscribed to the SAM list after the hols, > I seem to have missed all the hype about the accelerator. > Is it just a fast processor that's slowed down for memory & > io accesses, or is it a fast processor with 512K of fast > ram mimicing the SAM's RAM for reads? (but not writes). You've got it right on the 2nd count... same design as when I first came up with it at the beginning of '93 at the moment, with an 8Mhz Z80, and 512k SRAM... slows down for processor writes and IO... Of course, the finished version will only slow down for *some* writes... And will have an 18-40MHz processor in it :) Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 17:22:42 1995 Message-Id: From: Andrew M Gale Subject: Re: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 17:20:13 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <199510101438.PAA04781@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 10, 95 03:37:34 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1192 Lines: 32 > > Is it just a fast processor that's slowed down for memory & > > io accesses, or is it a fast processor with 512K of fast > > ram mimicing the SAM's RAM for reads? (but not writes). > > You've got it right on the 2nd count... same design as when I first came up > with it at the beginning of '93 at the moment, with an 8Mhz Z80, and 512k > SRAM... slows down for processor writes and IO... > > Of course, the finished version will only slow down for *some* writes... > And will have an 18-40MHz processor in it :) > > Simon 512K of SRAM????!!!!!! Just how much is that going to cost?! I seem to remember communication on the mailing list last term that deduced that DRAM would be feasible (and, of course, cheaper) though it would slower... When you say slow down for /some/ writes, how do you propose doing this? The only way I can think of is: i) using cacheing techniques ii) Say that the screen can only reside in certain sections of memory iii) similar to ii) but copy from fast-ram to sam-ram whenever the VMPR port is altered (not very elegant). Another nice way of doing things would be to make your own video card using VRAMs - just modes 3 and 4. -Andrew From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 18:23:01 1995 From: R J Partington Message-Id: <199510101136.MAA01946@heffer.demon.co.uk> Subject: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 12:36:59 +0100 (BST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1307 Lines: 34 What about someone rewriting the DOS in a similar manner to the way Acorn do it? The DOS on the Archimedes is split into two distinct sections. 1) FileCore : handles the `nitty-gritty' of actually interfacing with hardware, and provides the core functions (like read a sector). 2) Filers : handles the filing systems (one filer module for each supported filing system) using FileCore calls. All you need to do to support a new disk format is to provide the appropriate filer module. This allows easy plugin of DOS disk support, archives which are just like normal directories, compressed filing systems, image filing systems (a big file behaves like a directory) etc.etc. I've _NO_ idea how easy this would be to do on the SAM, but it would make things like the KEDISK transferer a thing of the past. Then support for hard disks etc. is simply a matter of upgrading the FileCore to support HD's as well. I can do more `research' on how Acorn do it if people think this is a good idea (courtesy of the #99 manuals... :) Rob -- -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- Version: 2.3a mQBNAjBKNd0AAAECAKfvlvo09KjC+sP8CZz3WCXMyWfF0lVDojLmrheqevdszMML fmRgnXsG50RAvjhX4IKcPGUfYf0BcC01AeVyX7EABRG0KlJvYmVydCBQYXJ0aW5n dG9uIDxyanBAaGVmZmVyLmRlbW9uLmNvLnVrPg== =4uKS -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK------- From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 20:42:37 1995 Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 20:12:11 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11021@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Speed trials on the accelerator (v2) X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 155 Lines: 9 When you up the speed, does the asic get hotter due to more switching in the same timescale? Silly question no. 468.5... Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 21:13:32 1995 Message-Id: From: geoffw@minster.cs.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless) Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 21:12:53 +0100 In-Reply-To: rjp -- "Not very controversial, but the best I can do..." (Oct 10, 12:36pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1747 Lines: 38 On Oct 10, 12:36pm in "Not very controversial, but the best I can do...", you warbled: ] I've _NO_ idea how easy this would be to do on the SAM, but it would ] make things like the KEDISK transferer a thing of the past. Then ] support for hard disks etc. is simply a matter of upgrading the ] FileCore to support HD's as well. Well... making KEdisk work via filecore (ie using Hook codes, for people in the know of how dos works) slows it down by about 50%. Not worth it, in my humble opinion... (Of course the real reason KEDisk had its own code was because I couldn't work out why the Hook Codes just weren't working -- of course it was because I was putting the bloody code in page D, which then got paged out by DOS... or something along those lines...) ] I can do more `research' on how Acorn do it if people think this is a ] good idea (courtesy of the #99 manuals... :) Hmm. I don't think the Acorn way of doing things would really help much. As you say, it basically provides a level of abstraction from the hardware, thus of keeping the software compatible with just about anything (ie one sector editor works for DOS, Mac, RAM, Archives etc...) We already have something similar (on a far more primitive scale) in DOS, with the hook codes provided. The only thing that would need to be added would be a bit to intercept the hook codes before DOS gets them, something to work out which file system is actually relavent to the drive you're working with, and then pass the hook codes to that file system (which would then have to call DOS hook codes with a special bit set somewhere, perhaps, not sure). Unless you fancy rewriting the entire DOS, of course (And none of us are thinking of doing _that_, are we Si??? ;-) Geoff -- From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 10 21:14:11 1995 Message-Id: From: geoffw@minster.cs.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless) Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 21:13:40 +0100 In-Reply-To: Briansam -- "Re: Speed trials on the accelerator (v2)" (Oct 10, 8:12pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Speed trials on the accelerator (v2) Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 326 Lines: 10 On Oct 10, 8:12pm in "Re: Speed trials on the accelerator (v2)", you warbled: ] When you up the speed, does the asic get hotter due to more ] switching in the same timescale? ] ] Silly question no. 468.5... That won't be a problem, will it... just get one of those nice DEC nano-pumps to shove cold water round it :-) -- From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 09:19:19 1995 From: R J Partington Message-Id: <199510102225.XAA00652@heffer.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 23:25:52 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: from "Geoff Winkless" at Oct 10, 95 09:12:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 2152 Lines: 50 Geoff Winkless wrote... > > Well... making KEdisk work via filecore (ie using Hook codes, for people > in the know of how dos works) slows it down by about 50%. Not worth it, > in my humble opinion... Eeeugh! > (Of course the real reason KEDisk had its own code was because I couldn't > work out why the Hook Codes just weren't working -- of course it was > because I was putting the bloody code in page D, which then got paged > out by DOS... or something along those lines...) Similar thing happened to me. Moved SP to page C, called rst 10h, WHAM! Fell over quicker than a quick thing. > Hmm. I don't think the Acorn way of doing things would really help much. > As you say, it basically provides a level of abstraction from the > hardware, thus of keeping the software compatible with just about anything > (ie one sector editor works for DOS, Mac, RAM, Archives etc...) Well, yes. But it also provides transparent abstraction from the filing system... > We already have something similar (on a far more primitive scale) in > DOS, with the hook codes provided. But a lot of the hook codes seem to be rather SamDos specific... What I'm saying is that the hook codes (filer) should be non-filing system specific, and then a second layer implements the filing system specific stuff underneath that. Then to read dos disks, all you need is the code to understand dos disks (which already exists in KeDISK...) > The only thing that would need to be added would be a bit to intercept the > hook codes before DOS gets them, something to work out which file system > is actually relavent to the drive you're working with, and then pass the > hook codes to that file system (which would then have to call DOS > hook codes with a special bit set somewhere, perhaps, not sure). That's exactly what happens. Except that the hook codes aren't intercepted, but rather have a more abstract (ie not SamDos specific) layer on top. > Unless you fancy rewriting the entire DOS, of course (And none of us > are thinking of doing _that_, are we Si??? ;-) Give me a C compiler and I'll do it. I'm not too hot on assembly (unless it's ARM assembly...) Rob From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 09:32:32 1995 Message-Id: <199510110829.JAA13256@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 09:29:14 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: from "Andrew M Gale" at Oct 10, 95 05:20:13 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1559 Lines: 39 > 512K of SRAM????!!!!!! Just how much is that going to cost?! > I seem to remember communication on the mailing list last term > that deduced that DRAM would be feasible (and, of course, cheaper) > though it would slower... Wooooah... hang on... no need to worry that much - most of the cost of this thing has been borne by Martin & me... (ouch... 50 quid for 256k of SRAM...) The finished board will have a whole host of options - either 1Mb of DRAM, fast SRAM, a combination... you set the jumpers, and hey presto - more speed depending on which you plump for. > When you say slow down for /some/ writes, how do you propose doing > this? The only way I can think of is: > > i) using cacheing techniques That's something we're looking into at the moment (possibly necessary to work with the ASIC & standard Megs) > ii) Say that the screen can only reside in certain sections of > memory That's something we'll leave to the programmers - selectable on 4 ports - choose the ports you want to write through to the internal memory. > iii) similar to ii) but copy from fast-ram to sam-ram whenever > the VMPR port is altered (not very elegant). That'll be an optional way of doing it - for things like BASIC for example -- if you're paging an area into the VMPR for the first time, its "copy-thru" bit will be set, and the data will be blatted across. > Another nice way of doing things would be to make your own video > card using VRAMs - just modes 3 and 4. And to think that you were moaning about the costs of SRAM :) :) :) Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 09:32:49 1995 Message-Id: <199510110831.JAA13289@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 09:31:44 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: from "Geoff Winkless" at Oct 10, 95 09:12:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 358 Lines: 12 > Unless you fancy rewriting the entire DOS, of course (And none of us > are thinking of doing _that_, are we Si??? ;-) > > Geoff Um... no... wouldn't dream of it ... *blush* Simon ps I've probably got the only version of MasterDOS in the world that doesn't check for external memory when you boot it up :) (Damn these dodgy accelerator prototypes :) ) From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 09:34:10 1995 Message-Id: <199510110830.JAA13261@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Speed trials on the accelerator (v2) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 09:29:52 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <11021@bgserv.demon.co.uk> from "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." at Oct 10, 95 08:12:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 231 Lines: 8 > > When you up the speed, does the asic get hotter due to more > switching in the same timescale? It shouldn't do - most of the accesses don't go anywhere near the ASIC, and besides - the ASIC runs at 24MHz internally :) Simon From imc Wed Oct 11 11:07:20 1995 Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 11 Oct 95 11:07:20 BST In-Reply-To: <199510102225.XAA00652@heffer.demon.co.uk>; from "R J Partington" at Oct 10, 95 11:25 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 599 Lines: 13 On Tue, 10 Oct 1995 23:25:52 +0100 (BST), R J Partington said: > > (Of course the real reason KEDisk had its own code was because I couldn't > > work out why the Hook Codes just weren't working -- of course it was > > because I was putting the bloody code in page D, which then got paged > > out by DOS... or something along those lines...) > Similar thing happened to me. Moved SP to page C, called rst 10h, WHAM! > Fell over quicker than a quick thing. But DOS pages itself into section B so why would it affect those other sections? If it does then where on earth can you put the stack?! imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 11:56:49 1995 Message-Id: <199510111055.LAA14853@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 11:54:17 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510111007.AA01957@booth5.ecs.ox.ac.uk> from "Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk" at Oct 11, 95 11:07:20 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 382 Lines: 11 > But DOS pages itself into section B so why would it affect those other > sections? If it does then where on earth can you put the stack?! > > imc Welll... according to the source code, when you use a hook code, the DOS has its own personal stack which it uses... Simon ps I'm thinking of putting the source to SAMDOS 2.2 up on the Net if I get Bruce's permission... comments? From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 12:29:25 1995 Message-Id: <11810.199510111125@lenzie.cent.gla.ac.uk> Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 12:25:58 +0100 X-Sender: 9264201e@udcf.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no From: Will Easson <9264201e@student.gla.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 231 Lines: 9 At 11:54 11/10/95 +0100, you wrote: >ps I'm thinking of putting the source to SAMDOS 2.2 up on the Net if I get >Bruce's permission... comments? Why? Didn't Andy Wright do that on the MGT Discs? Or was that just the ROM? -Will From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 12:35:12 1995 Message-Id: <10824.199510111122@lenzie.cent.gla.ac.uk> Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 12:22:52 +0100 X-Sender: 9264201e@udcf.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no From: Will Easson <9264201e@student.gla.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Speed trials on the accelerator (v2) Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 528 Lines: 18 At 21:13 10/10/95 +0100, you wrote: >On Oct 10, 8:12pm in "Re: Speed trials on the accelerator (v2)", you warbled: >] When you up the speed, does the asic get hotter due to more >] switching in the same timescale? >] >] Silly question no. 468.5... > >That won't be a problem, will it... just get one of those nice DEC >nano-pumps to shove cold water round it :-) > Or a fan. That'll be fun - strapping a fan to the back of the SAM. Or even, sticking the SAM into a full-height tower case. Anyone tried that? -Will Easson From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 12:35:34 1995 From: L.Willis@comp.brad.ac.uk Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 12:33:53 +0100 Message-Id: <4376.199510111133@dcsun4.comp.brad.ac.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 139 Lines: 7 > ps I'm thinking of putting the source to SAMDOS 2.2 up on the Net if I get > Bruce's permission... comments? What a nice idea. Moog. From imc Wed Oct 11 12:39:59 1995 Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 11 Oct 95 12:39:59 BST In-Reply-To: <199510111055.LAA14853@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no>; from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 11, 95 11:54 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 281 Lines: 8 On Wed, 11 Oct 1995 11:54:17 +0100 (BST), Simon Cooke said: > ps I'm thinking of putting the source to SAMDOS 2.2 up on the Net if I get > Bruce's permission... comments? I printed out a disassembly of SamDos 2. last month, but I haven't really looked at it yet... imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 13:27:23 1995 Message-Id: From: geoffw@minster.cs.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless) Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 13:25:55 +0100 In-Reply-To: Ian.Collier -- "Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do..." (Oct 11, 11:07am) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 935 Lines: 23 On Oct 11, 11:07am in "Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do...", you warbled: ] But DOS pages itself into section B so why would it affect those other ] sections? If it does then where on earth can you put the stack?! Uhhhhh... let me see... I think I was compiling in B-page 16384, which was my problem. God alone knows what RJP's was. I was young, I didn't understand paging properly, I just saw the bit that said `this part will always be paged in' and thought `ahh, why not use that for KEdisk...' What I ended up with was probably just as sick. I would have done it completely different now... (ie just write my own DOS to handle both SAM and DOS disks, just as Si is -supposed- to be doing) (AREN'T you si...) I dunno. Some people, too few eggs in too many baskets, etc. etc. etc If you get a 40MHz board running for under 150 quid I'll start writing for the Sam again, Si. Now there's a promise... ;-) -- From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 13:29:16 1995 Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 13:26:40 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510111226.AA18085@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 219 Lines: 9 > >ps I'm thinking of putting the source to SAMDOS 2.2 up on the Net if I get > >Bruce's permission... comments? > > Why? Didn't Andy Wright do that on the MGT Discs? Or was that just the ROM? Only the ROM. -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 13:30:51 1995 Message-Id: From: geoffw@minster.cs.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless) Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 13:29:43 +0100 In-Reply-To: Ian.Collier -- "Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do..." (Oct 11, 12:39pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 675 Lines: 27 On Oct 11, 12:39pm in "Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do...", you warbled: ] On Wed, 11 Oct 1995 11:54:17 +0100 (BST), Simon Cooke said: ] > ps I'm thinking of putting the source to SAMDOS 2.2 up on the Net if I get ] > Bruce's permission... comments? ] ] I printed out a disassembly of SamDos 2. last month, but I haven't ] really looked at it yet... The difference between ld hl, &4293 (note, I have no idea what &4293 would be in DOS, and I don't want to know) ld a, (hl) (similar blah) and ld hl, MY_START ; start address of data ld a, (hl) ; get number of words to write (similar blah) should be blindingly obvious to all. G. -- From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 13:58:55 1995 Message-Id: From: geoffw@minster.cs.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless) Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 13:56:21 +0100 X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: linux, FreeBSD etc Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1142 Lines: 25 With the impending possibility of a decent-speed sam, the imminence of various Hard Drives and the arrival of the (bare bones, admittedly) C compiler, who would be interested in porting Linux (or BSD) to the new machine? Sam as it stands just isn't capable of this kind of system, but with 4M RAM, a hd and c compiler we could knock something up that might be worth running. My personal feeling is that we should try and aim for a basic Unix system written purely in z80. People say `use C' but unfortunately that way lies code bloat. Original systems fitted in to 64k. I would suggest that it would be possible (if the z380 has a decent MMU) to write a functional unix (by todays standards) that could run on a single meg without too much disk hammering, but most of the core would -have- to be written in z(3)80 code. As will be patently obvious I haven't really thought this through but this would -not- be a short or particularly easy job, something of a labour of love. More a question of `yes it is possible' rather than `hey let's make everyone buy a sam'.. Ideas, criticisms, personality assassinations to this group please! -- From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 16:00:58 1995 Message-Id: From: Andrew M Gale Subject: h/ware update To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 15:29:00 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <199510110829.JAA13256@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 11, 95 09:29:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 413 Lines: 20 Since there'es probably quite a few of us not going to the show, I was wondering if the various technical geniuses behind the projects we used to here plenty about could let us know how they're getting on. These were the ones I was thinking of: *Termite *HD *Samdac *Quazar *PC keyboard i/face *SAM thermal printer (similar to ZX printer) Just alive/dead/teething would be a welcome comment! Thanks, Andrew From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 16:06:05 1995 Message-Id: From: Andrew M Gale Subject: Re: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 15:31:35 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <199510110829.JAA13256@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 11, 95 09:29:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 214 Lines: 10 > > > Another nice way of doing things would be to make your own video > > card using VRAMs - just modes 3 and 4. > > And to think that you were moaning about the costs of SRAM :) :) :) > > Simon point taken! From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 16:38:26 1995 From: Tim Paveley Message-Id: <1382.9510111529@titian.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Subject: Re: h/ware update To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 16:29:56 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: from "Andrew M Gale" at Oct 11, 95 03:29:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 990 Lines: 27 To Quote Andrew M Gale : > Since there'es probably quite a few of us not going to > the show, I was wondering if the various technical geniuses You're not going to the show, tut-tut, shame on you :-) > behind the projects we used to here plenty about could > let us know how they're getting on. These were the ones > I was thinking of: > > *SAM thermal printer (similar to ZX printer) Oooooh! I never heard of this one. Whoever is working on this one, don't take this wrong, but what advantage is there for a Thermal Printer? I imagine there probably is something, buit I can't think of it. Mind you The ZX Printer was just the right size for doing cassette Inlays :-) I'm still going to the show BTW, so feel free to flame this comment IRL! (I now have an offical Sad Snail Productiosn Photo ID Card which I might wear, but only if I feel in a particularly silly mood) ....@/ -- Tim Paveley - University of Southampton Sam Coupe Web Pages: http://whig.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~tsp93/Coupe/ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 19:37:05 1995 From: Colin G Piggot Date: Wed, 11 Oct 95 19:36:00 BST Message-Id: <14219.9510111836@pasta.st-andrews.ac.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: h/ware update Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 224 Lines: 6 The Quazar Surround is alive and on sale - it has been for several months. For all the details, email me your postal address and I'll send all the details about the hardware and the software thats available. Colin Piggot. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 11 20:24:31 1995 Date: Wed, 11 Oct 95 20:17:01 PDT From: Stefan Drissen Subject: RE: h/ware update To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no X-Mailer: Chameleon - TCP/IP for Windows by NetManage, Inc. Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1319 Lines: 32 >Since there'es probably quite a few of us not going to >the show, I was wondering if the various technical geniuses >behind the projects we used to here plenty about could >let us know how they're getting on. These were the ones >I was thinking of: > >*Samdac Been finished a long time ago. I was even selling them at the last Gloucester show and will be doing so again on Saturday. Available for a mere 25 pounds (including a copy of the SAM MOD player version 2.03 RRP 5 pounds) either at the show or from Ben Versteeg (who should be on this mailing list too). Connects to your printer interface (or port on the SAM elite) and the audio socket and lets you play mods in lovely 7 bit resolution in stereo. You can also use it to play WAV files and the like at a nice 8 bit resolution. I'm currently tidying up a piece of code which will let you output 4 samples at 10.4khz on the SAA1099 (=soundchip), SAMdac, printerdac, Blue Alpha Sampler and Quazar. This is of course basically a ripped up mod player (ie without the sequencer) but I'm having trouble making it all nice and easy for the user to use. Anybody invented a time stopper? Stefan Drissen aka Solar Flare of Entropy E-mail: drissen@pi.net S-mail: Zevende Herven 6, 5232 JZ 's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands T-mail: +31-73-414969 From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 01:26:26 1995 From: R J Partington Message-Id: <199510120024.BAA02333@heffer.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 01:24:46 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: from "Geoff Winkless" at Oct 11, 95 01:56:21 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1937 Lines: 51 Geoff Winkless wrote... > > With the impending possibility of a decent-speed sam, the imminence of > various Hard Drives and the arrival of the (bare bones, admittedly) C > compiler, who would be interested in porting Linux (or BSD) to the > new machine? EeeeeeeeeeK! Linux?!? It's bad enough trying to compile it on this machine (486DX2/66 with 8MB memory, 10MB source code), although you could probably junk some of the drivers. But you're still looking at 6-10MB of C source code. Heaven only knows what a Z80 version would be like! > Sam as it stands just isn't capable of this kind of system, but with > 4M RAM, a hd and c compiler we could knock something up that might > be worth running. I've got ArmLinux on my 4MB A5000 (Archimedes). That doesn't run at all... :( > My personal feeling is that we should try and aim for a basic Unix > system written purely in z80. This is a good idea. I like Unix. > People say `use C' but unfortunately > that way lies code bloat. Original systems fitted in to 64k. I would > suggest that it would be possible (if the z380 has a decent MMU) to > write a functional unix (by todays standards) that could > run on a single meg without too much disk hammering, but most of the > core would -have- to be written in z(3)80 code. Well, Linux on this machine takes up around 3.5MB just booting up. It might be tricky to get it into 1MB... > As will be patently obvious I haven't really thought this through but > this would -not- be a short or particularly easy job, something of a > labour of love. More a question of `yes it is possible' rather than > `hey let's make everyone buy a sam'.. I'll be in it if people are going to give it a go... > Ideas, criticisms, personality assassinations to this group please! What about X as well? Now that *would* be impressive on a SAM... :) RJP ps RE: My stack problem was in conjunction with FORTH for the SAM. Still doesn't work though. :( From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 09:01:43 1995 Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 09:00:14 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510120800.AA18858@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 3017 Lines: 82 > Geoff Winkless wrote... > > > > With the impending possibility of a decent-speed sam, the imminence of > > various Hard Drives and the arrival of the (bare bones, admittedly) C > > compiler, who would be interested in porting Linux (or BSD) to the > > new machine? > > EeeeeeeeeeK! Linux?!? It's bad enough trying to compile it on this > machine (486DX2/66 with 8MB memory, 10MB source code), although you > could probably junk some of the drivers. But you're still looking at > 6-10MB of C source code. Heaven only knows what a Z80 version would > be like! SOME of the drivers??? My guess is that you can junk around 70% of everything that's in there. What is the point of having support for Appleshare, 387 emulation, support for X number of filesystems, umsdos- support, cd-rom (perhaps in the future? :), etc. > > > Sam as it stands just isn't capable of this kind of system, but with > > 4M RAM, a hd and c compiler we could knock something up that might > > be worth running. > > I've got ArmLinux on my 4MB A5000 (Archimedes). That doesn't run at > all... :( Minix ran on an 8086 with 640K. > > > My personal feeling is that we should try and aim for a basic Unix > > system written purely in z80. > > This is a good idea. I like Unix. Me too. > > > People say `use C' but unfortunately > > that way lies code bloat. Original systems fitted in to 64k. I would > > suggest that it would be possible (if the z380 has a decent MMU) to > > write a functional unix (by todays standards) that could > > run on a single meg without too much disk hammering, but most of the > > core would -have- to be written in z(3)80 code. > > Well, Linux on this machine takes up around 3.5MB just booting up. > It might be tricky to get it into 1MB... It is not impossible. In fact, if the C-compiler is good (let's face it, most of the non-time critical code is already there so why not use it? - the main problem is to get the code re-entrant and perhas dynamically linked? :), a usable Linux-port could be done in 250-300K of kernel. However, the question is if it is possible to use the MMU of the z380? SI? > > > As will be patently obvious I haven't really thought this through but > > this would -not- be a short or particularly easy job, something of a > > labour of love. More a question of `yes it is possible' rather than > > `hey let's make everyone buy a sam'.. > > I'll be in it if people are going to give it a go... I might. If we do a propper design, we might be able to split the thing up into parts that can be coded indvidually. > > > Ideas, criticisms, personality assassinations to this group please! > > What about X as well? Now that *would* be impressive on a SAM... :) Running X on a machine with only 4Mb is darn slow. I'd rather have multiple virtual terminals, but it won't be impossible either I guess. > > RJP > > ps RE: My stack problem was in conjunction with FORTH for the SAM. > Still doesn't work though. :( Forth for SAM - isn't that a step backwrds? :) -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 09:24:17 1995 Message-Id: <199510120822.JAA26783@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: h/ware update To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 09:22:01 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: from "Andrew M Gale" at Oct 11, 95 03:29:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1311 Lines: 45 > > Since there'es probably quite a few of us not going to > the show, I was wondering if the various technical geniuses > behind the projects we used to here plenty about could > let us know how they're getting on. These were the ones > I was thinking of: Genii surely? :) Okay: > *Termite Still in the middle of a rewrite - rejigging all of the code in an effort to get the most speed out of it (like using David Zambonini's Interlaced printing method for one)... also necessary to enable to the use of a scroll buffer... and it all needs reshuffling anyway to get the file handling in there :( Work work work work work. > *HD Our (ie Martin Rookyard's & mine) harddrive is on hold for the moment - we thought we'd steal Bob's thunder later with a much better version... possibly integral to the accelerator (ooops... was I meant to tell anyone that? :) ) > *Samdac Stefan's dept :) > *Quazar CPG's Dept :) > *PC keyboard i/face Well, I'll be bringing it to the show. apparently bob has one (Speccy only, requires driver software to be loaded on the Speccy... oh dear...)... Mine at the moment runs from the SAM, the finished unit will be standalone, and I've already had the LED's flashing in time to the FRED 18 menu's music :) > *SAM thermal printer (similar to ZX printer) Not a clue! Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 09:30:49 1995 Message-Id: <199510120830.JAA26838@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 09:29:28 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510120800.AA18858@asmal.edh-net> from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 12, 95 09:00:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1713 Lines: 36 [Linux for the SAM] > > > People say `use C' but unfortunately > > > that way lies code bloat. Original systems fitted in to 64k. I would > > > suggest that it would be possible (if the z380 has a decent MMU) to > > > write a functional unix (by todays standards) that could > > > run on a single meg without too much disk hammering, but most of the > > > core would -have- to be written in z(3)80 code. > > > > Well, Linux on this machine takes up around 3.5MB just booting up. > > It might be tricky to get it into 1MB... > > It is not impossible. In fact, if the C-compiler is good (let's face > it, most of the non-time critical code is already there so why not > use it? - the main problem is to get the code re-entrant and perhas > dynamically linked? :), a usable Linux-port could be done in > 250-300K of kernel. However, the question is if it is possible to > use the MMU of the z380? SI? Right... I'm with Geoff on coding it in Z80 by the way - C does lead to a fair bit of bloat unfortunately... :( (Which is why I think Nev Young's course of writing the HD dos in C is a pretty awful one). The problem here is with the MMU... while the Z380 has facilities for reducing the chip count needed to access memory modules, it doesn't have an MMU per se - just a 4Gb address space. So, if processes go walkabout, we could be talking serious problems... I'm going to have to ask Zilog nicely if they've got an MMU finished for it yet I think... I'll get back to you on it... (The alternative is to replace every memory access with an undefined opcode followed by the address it is to go to, followed by the data to be written... slow, but it'd do it, as the Z380 traps the undefined ones now...) Simon From imc Thu Oct 12 11:09:42 1995 Subject: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 11:09:42 BST X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 50 Lines: 3 By the way, what time does this thing start? imc From imc Thu Oct 12 11:11:31 1995 Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 11:11:31 BST In-Reply-To: ; from "Geoff Winkless" at Oct 11, 95 1:29 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 469 Lines: 22 On Wed, 11 Oct 1995 13:29:43 +0100, Geoff Winkless said: > The difference between > > ld hl, &4293 > (note, I have no idea what &4293 would be in DOS, and I don't want to know) > ld a, (hl) > (similar blah) > > and > > ld hl, MY_START ; start address of data > ld a, (hl) ; get number of words to write > > (similar blah) > > should be blindingly obvious to all. Of course. I never said it wasn't. (Then again, I've seen Dr Wright's coding style...) imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 11:27:00 1995 Message-Id: From: Andrew M Gale Subject: Re: h/ware update To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 11:13:57 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <199510120822.JAA26783@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 12, 95 09:22:01 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 597 Lines: 16 > > > *PC keyboard i/face > > Well, I'll be bringing it to the show. apparently bob has one (Speccy only, > requires driver software to be loaded on the Speccy... oh dear...)... > > Mine at the moment runs from the SAM, the finished unit will be standalone, > and I've already had the LED's flashing in time to the FRED 18 menu's music > :) > This sounds promising. DO you mean that at the moment you need a software patch? And if the final version is to be hardware entirely (and hence invisible to the SAM user) will there be any limit on the number of keys depressed at any one moment? From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 12:06:25 1995 Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 12:01:18 +0100 (MET) From: Ben Versteeg Subject: Re: h/ware update In-Reply-To: from "Stefan Drissen" at Oct 11, 95 08:17:01 pm To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Message-Id: <199510121101.MAA07696@charm.il.ft.hse.nl> X-Envelope-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.NO X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Content-Type: text Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1446 Lines: 36 > > > >Since there'es probably quite a few of us not going to > >the show, I was wondering if the various technical geniuses > >behind the projects we used to here plenty about could > >let us know how they're getting on. These were the ones > >I was thinking of: > > > >*Samdac > > Been finished a long time ago. I was even selling them at the last > Gloucester show and will be doing so again on Saturday. Available for a mere > 25 pounds (including a copy of the SAM MOD player version 2.03 RRP 5 pounds) > either at the show or from Ben Versteeg (who should be on this mailing list > too). And here I am. Sorry I'm not able of going to the show. I have to study a lot. But maybe next time. > > Connects to your printer interface (or port on the SAM elite) and the audio > socket and lets you play mods in lovely 7 bit resolution in stereo. You can > also use it to play WAV files and the like at a nice 8 bit resolution. I'm > currently tidying up a piece of code which will let you output 4 samples at > 10.4khz on the SAA1099 (=soundchip), SAMdac, printerdac, Blue Alpha Sampler > and Quazar. This is of course basically a ripped up mod player (ie without > the sequencer) but I'm having trouble making it all nice and easy for the > user to use. Anybody invented a time stopper? > > Stefan Drissen aka Solar Flare of Entropy > Questions about the SamDac ? Or problems ? mail: ben@charm.il.ft.hse.nl Ben Versteeg From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 12:11:47 1995 Message-Id: <199510121110.MAA28567@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: h/ware update To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 12:10:06 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: from "Andrew M Gale" at Oct 12, 95 11:13:57 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 743 Lines: 19 [Pc keyboard] > This sounds promising. DO you mean that at the moment you need a software > patch? And if the final version is to be hardware entirely (and hence > invisible to the SAM user) will there be any limit on the number of keys > depressed at any one moment? At the moment you'd need a software patch (I still have to get around to writing the full keyboard decode)... But the final version shouldn't have any real limit on the no' of keys depressed... not any more than you'd need to, say, play a game useing 6,7,8,9,0 or perhaps to modify a keypress using CTRL SHIFT ALT... :) And the finished one will allow you to send an NMI (CTRL-ALT-BREAK), and a RESET (CTRL-ALT-DELETE) using the keyboard... all hardware too :) Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 12:19:39 1995 From: Tim Paveley Message-Id: <14486.9510121052@titian.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Sam show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 11:52:30 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <9510121009.AA03798@booth5.ecs.ox.ac.uk> from "Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk" at Oct 12, 95 11:09:43 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 218 Lines: 11 To Quote Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk : > By the way, what time does this thing start? 10am -> 4pm-ish ....@/ -- Tim Paveley - University of Southampton Sam Coupe Web Pages: http://whig.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~tsp93/Coupe/ From imc Thu Oct 12 12:47:05 1995 Subject: Re: h/ware update To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 12:47:05 BST In-Reply-To: <199510121110.MAA28567@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no>; from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 12, 95 12:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 167 Lines: 6 On Thu, 12 Oct 1995 12:10:06 +0100 (BST), Simon Cooke said: > And the finished one will allow you to send an NMI (CTRL-ALT-BREAK) A debounced one, I hope... :-) imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 13:13:08 1995 Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 13:01:24 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510121201.AA19011@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1609 Lines: 38 > > It is not impossible. In fact, if the C-compiler is good (let's face > > it, most of the non-time critical code is already there so why not > > use it? - the main problem is to get the code re-entrant and perhas > > dynamically linked? :), a usable Linux-port could be done in > > 250-300K of kernel. However, the question is if it is possible to > > use the MMU of the z380? SI? > > Right... I'm with Geoff on coding it in Z80 by the way - C does lead to a > fair bit of bloat unfortunately... :( (Which is why I think Nev Young's > course of writing the HD dos in C is a pretty awful one). The bloatednes of binaries compiled with a C-compiler depends on the C-compiler. I've seen very good C-compilers and I've seen awful ones - where is SAMC (those of you who have tried it)? The point was that it takes quite a while to code (and maintain) assembly code. Of course, it would be better to code it all in z80, but is it realistic? > The problem here is with the MMU... while the Z380 has facilities for > reducing the chip count needed to access memory modules, it doesn't have an > MMU per se - just a 4Gb address space. So, if processes go walkabout, we > could be talking serious problems... > > I'm going to have to ask Zilog nicely if they've got an MMU finished for it > yet I think... I'll get back to you on it... How about a Z480? :) > > (The alternative is to replace every memory access with an undefined opcode > followed by the address it is to go to, followed by the data to be > written... slow, but it'd do it, as the Z380 traps the undefined ones > now...) *grunt* -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 13:57:16 1995 Message-Id: <199510121242.NAA29520@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: h/ware update To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 13:42:01 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510121147.AA04074@booth15.ecs.ox.ac.uk> from "Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk" at Oct 12, 95 12:47:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 265 Lines: 11 > > On Thu, 12 Oct 1995 12:10:06 +0100 (BST), Simon Cooke said: > > And the finished one will allow you to send an NMI (CTRL-ALT-BREAK) > > A debounced one, I hope... :-) > > imc Oh yeah.. no way to send anything BUT a debounced one from the keyboard :) Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 12 19:11:55 1995 Message-Id: <199510121809.TAA17297@tower.york.ac.uk> From: gaw2@mailer.york.ac.uk (Mars Bar) Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 19:09:16 +0100 In-Reply-To: simonc -- "Chris can't make it... so I'm coming with you :)" (Oct 12, 6:23pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT)) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: anyone want a lift? Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 2377 Lines: 51 I'm driving down to gloucester on sat, via manchester (si is coming too :-) and in order to cut petrol costs (and generally to get into the spirit of things!) I was wondering if anyone else would like to come too... ] This is the quickest route that Autoroute came up with: ] Time Instruction Road Dist Dir Towards ] 00:00 DEPART York (N Yorkshire) on the A19 1/4 mile NW (Shipton) ] 00:00 Turn left onto A1036 4 miles S ] 00:09 Turn right onto A64 17 miles W (Tadcaster) ] 00:33 Turn off onto A6120 1 mile S ] 00:34 Turn off onto A64 4 miles W Leeds ] 00:40 At A58(M) turn off onto A58(M) 1/2 mile W *Check access* ] 00:40 At Kirkstall stay on the A58(M) 1 mile W (A58(M)) ] 00:41 At A58(M) stay on the A58 1/2 mile S *Check access* ] 00:42 Turn off onto A643 1 mile S (M621 J2) ] 00:43 At M621 J2 turn right onto M621 4 miles W (M621 J1) ] 00:47 At M62 J27 M621 turn off onto M62 38 miles W (Denshaw) ] 01:19 At M62 J13 turn off onto A572 2 miles W Leigh ] 01:22 Turn right onto A577 1 mile N Wigan ] 01:25 ARRIVE Tyldesley (Gtr Manchester) ] 01:25 DEPART Tyldesley (Gtr Manchester) on the A577 1 mile E ] 01:28 Turn left onto A572 2 miles E (M62 J13) ] 01:31 At M62 J13 turn right onto M62 10 miles S (Huyton) ] 01:39 At M62 J10 M6 J21a turn off onto M6 73 miles SE (Lymm) ] 02:43 At M6 J8 M5 turn off onto M5 52 miles S Avonmouth ] 03:29 At M5 J11 turn off onto A40 5 miles W Ross ] 03:36 Turn off onto A38 1/2 mile S ] 03:37 Bear left onto A430 1 mile S ] 03:39 Bear right onto Unnamed 1/4 mile S Gloucester ] 03:40 ARRIVE Gloucester (Gloucestershire) Now if anyone else who lives on that route (or can get a lift to part of the route from a mate, say) wants a lift to gloucester, doesn't mind me choosing the music on the stereo and isn't too bothered about my sometimes-erratic driving, mail me at the address I have above, ie gaw2@york.ac.uk, aswell as geoffw@jumper.mcc.ac.uk -- my york address will disappear soon, and will probably do it just when someone sends me some mail, but the link to mcc is up and down tonight so it's probably best to send it to both boxes... I don't really want to make too much of a diversion from the route though, the journey's going to be long enough as it is... but a mile or so would be just about acceptable... Sorry this is so late but we only decided about 10 minutes ago :-) Cheers Geoff From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 13 12:18:26 1995 Message-Id: <9510131116.AA22812@dxmint.cern.ch> From: Allan Skillman (Dr Kid) Subject: Anyone travelling to Gloucester from Leicester/Northants? To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 13 Oct 95 12:16:19 MET Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 658 Lines: 19 Hi All, I'm planning on travelling down to Gloucester tomorrow (by train), but I just wondered if anyone is going by car in the Leicester/Northants area and would like some company/petrol money/a couple of pints. If not I will be going to Gloucester via London (I have a season ticket from Kettering - so that leg is easy). Anyone want to meet up at Paddington? I will be bringing along a copy of my new Driver Application Dmines (yes it is another mines game - but this time for Driver, and I really coded it to learn about Driver programming). Also I have a little project in the works and I might bring along a sneak preview.....;) Cheers Allan -- From imc Fri Oct 13 12:22:51 1995 Subject: Re: anyone want a lift? To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 13 Oct 95 12:22:51 BST X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 433 Lines: 14 Mars Bar said... >I'm driving down to gloucester on sat, via manchester (si is coming >too :-) I've heard that David Ledbury is taking a minibus from T'North to Gloucester, and that he expects Simon to be on it... imc PS Don't suppose there's any chance of a lift from Oxford? ;-) Otherwise I have to change at Didcot _and_ Swindon. :-( The first National Express coach leaves at 12.15 so that isn't really an option... From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 13 12:51:27 1995 Message-Id: <199510131150.MAA08178@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: anyone want a lift?u To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 12:50:18 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510131122.AA06537@booth5.ecs.ox.ac.uk> from "Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk" at Oct 13, 95 12:22:51 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 359 Lines: 15 > > Mars Bar said... > > >I'm driving down to gloucester on sat, via manchester (si is coming > >too :-) > > I've heard that David Ledbury is taking a minibus from T'North to > Gloucester, and that he expects Simon to be on it... Yeah... it's just a pity that I told Dave three times in the last fortnight that I was NOT coming on the minibus. :( Simon From imc Fri Oct 13 12:54:19 1995 Subject: Re: anyone want a lift?u To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 13 Oct 95 12:54:19 BST In-Reply-To: <199510131150.MAA08178@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no>; from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 13, 95 12:50 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 272 Lines: 8 On Fri, 13 Oct 1995 12:50:18 +0100 (BST), Simon Cooke said: > Yeah... it's just a pity that I told Dave three times in the last fortnight > that I was NOT coming on the minibus. I suppose the fact the my brother is going on it has nothing to do with that... :-) :-) imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 13 13:28:04 1995 From: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Message-Id: <9510131225.AA19725@namu24.gwdg.de> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Cc: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 11 Oct 95 11:54:17 +0100." <199510111055.LAA14853@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Date: Fri, 13 Oct 95 13:25:00 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 515 Lines: 17 .... >Welll... according to the source code, when you use a hook code, the DOS has >its own personal stack which it uses... > >Simon > >ps I'm thinking of putting the source to SAMDOS 2.2 up on the Net if I get >Bruce's permission... comments? Do this !!! When You wait on Termite , don't do it . I will put my new Comm'ix Terminal , now interrupt controlled and for all on Net full free . This work with 14400 bps modem and 19200 bps ser on Sam ! ( not 38400 ! ) with ANSI without lost of anything . Slawek. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 13 13:36:32 1995 From: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Message-Id: <9510131229.AA19741@namu24.gwdg.de> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Cc: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Subject: Re: h/ware update In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 11 Oct 95 15:29:00 +0100." Date: Fri, 13 Oct 95 13:29:00 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 125 Lines: 7 ... >*HD You can make Your own HD IDE interface . I have upload the Circuit to nvg... Now I write a dos for it ... Slawek. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 13 14:03:52 1995 Message-Id: From: geoffw@minster.cs.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless) Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 14:02:19 +0100 In-Reply-To: slawek -- "Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do..." (Oct 13, 1:25pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 662 Lines: 17 On Oct 13, 1:25pm in "Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do...", you warbled: ] When You wait on Termite , don't do it . I will put my new Comm'ix Terminal , ] now interrupt controlled and for all on Net full free . This work with 14400 bps ] modem and 19200 bps ser on Sam ! ( not 38400 ! ) with ANSI without lost of ] anything . I thought the point about termite was that it could do stuff like PPP and SLIP aswell as providing a browser... or something along those lines? You'll also have to rename it, Si, since Doggysoft (what a name...) are already using Termite as the name for -their- internet package on the Acorn machines. G. -- From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 13 14:23:34 1995 Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 14:21:47 +0100 (BST) From: Steve Taylor X-Sender: sct1000@blue.csi.cam.ac.uk To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Anyone travelling to Gloucester from Leicester/Northants? In-Reply-To: <9510131116.AA22812@dxmint.cern.ch> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 578 Lines: 15 On Fri, 13 Oct 1995, Allan Skillman wrote: > I will be bringing along a copy of my new Driver Application Dmines (yes it is > another mines game - but this time for Driver, and I really coded it to learn > about Driver programming). oooooooohh!!! +--------------------------------------------------------------+ | Steve Taylor sct1000@cam.ac.uk | | Pembroke College http://nikita.pem.cam.ac.uk/sct1000/ | | Cambridge CB2 1RF | +--------------------------------------------------------------+ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 13 15:11:58 1995 Message-Id: X-Sender: scooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 15:02:24 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no From: simon.cooke@umist.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) Subject: Re: anyone want a lift?u Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 853 Lines: 21 >Status: > >On Fri, 13 Oct 1995 12:50:18 +0100 (BST), Simon Cooke said: >> Yeah... it's just a pity that I told Dave three times in the last fortnight >> that I was NOT coming on the minibus. > >I suppose the fact the my brother is going on it has nothing to do with >that... :-) :-) Nothing at all to do with it - when I was still thinking of going on the minibus (ie 3 weeks or so ago), it was me who suggested Dave asking Andrew to come along. I wanted to iron out a few problems on the trip :) Simon -!- Mains Hum: A sine of the times??? +- Email:Simon.Cooke@umist.ac.uk ---- Fidonet: 2:250/124.2 (Simon Cooke) -+ | Snail:1 Dovey Close, Astley, Tyldesley, Manchester, M29 7NP, UK | | Tel: (01942) 886084 Fax: (01942) 886084 (ring voice first to confirm!)| +- WWW: http://jumper.mcc.ac.uk/~simonc ----------------------------------+ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 13 15:30:52 1995 Date: Fri, 13 Oct 95 15:27:35 PDT From: Stefan Drissen Subject: CU tomorrow... To: SAM users X-Mailer: Chameleon - TCP/IP for Windows by NetManage, Inc. Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 737 Lines: 22 This is my last mail before Saturday. My journey begins in a few hours, see you all at the show.... Due to you stupid British ********, your still on summertime (or daylight savings or whatever you want to call it) and I don't win an hour with my journey over, this means that I can't catch the 7.18 (I thought it was) via Swindon to Gloucester but have to take the 9.18 meaning that I won't be at the show till 12 o'clockish. Next year the strange island inhabitants will have finally joined the rest of Europe with putting the clock backwards and forwards.... L8R Stefan Drissen aka Solar Flare of Entropy E-mail: drissen@pi.net S-mail: Zevende Herven 6, 5232 JZ 's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands T-mail: +31-73-414969 From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 13 16:24:26 1995 Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 16:23:29 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510131523.AA21126@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: CU tomorrow... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 231 Lines: 7 > Next year the strange island inhabitants will have finally joined the rest of > Europe with putting the clock backwards and forwards.... And guess what that does to products from a certain operating system vendor? ;-) -Frode From imc Fri Oct 13 16:33:54 1995 Subject: Re: CU tomorrow... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 13 Oct 95 16:33:54 BST In-Reply-To: ; from "Stefan Drissen" at Oct 13, 95 3:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 416 Lines: 14 On Fri, 13 Oct 95 15:27:35 PDT, Stefan Drissen said: ^^^ > Due to you stupid British ********, your still on summertime (or daylight > savings or whatever you want to call it) Well at least our mail shows the correct timezone... > Next year the strange island inhabitants will have finally joined the rest of > Europe with putting the clock backwards and forwards.... Says who? imc From imc Fri Oct 13 16:34:33 1995 Subject: Re: CU tomorrow... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 13 Oct 95 16:34:33 BST In-Reply-To: <9510131523.AA21126@asmal.edh-net>; from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 13, 95 4:23 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 166 Lines: 7 On Fri, 13 Oct 1995 16:23:29 +0100, Frode Tenneboe said: > And guess what that does to products from a certain operating system > vendor? ;-) What's that then? imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 13 21:21:09 1995 Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 21:12:53 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11097@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Not very controversial, but the best I can do... X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 343 Lines: 12 I believe there is a Termite that runs on a Mac as well. I suggested we use a Y indtead of an I. By the way, its the Speccy that is going to need the keyboard. There are now VERY FEW membranes left, and as Bill Richardson is retiring and I am going 'hobby only', I see little prospect of any more being made. Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Sat Oct 14 15:08:16 1995 Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 15:06:46 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510141406.AA21571@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: CU tomorrow... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 207 Lines: 9 > On Fri, 13 Oct 1995 16:23:29 +0100, Frode Tenneboe said: > > And guess what that does to products from a certain operating system > > vendor? ;-) > > What's that then? Mickysoft and Windows 95. -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Sun Oct 15 11:42:06 1995 Message-Id: <199510151010.LAA17707@willow.soton.ac.uk> Subject: Web Pages Move To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Sun, 15 Oct 1995 11:10:33 +0100 (BST) From: "T.S.Paveley" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 610 Lines: 30 Hi all, due to circumstances beyond my control, I have lost my ecs.soton.ac.uk account. I have therefore had to move my web pages. The New URL is http://www.soton.ac.uk/~tsp93ma/Coupe/ my new email is tsp93ma@soton.ac.uk Please could you change any links that you may have. Any more direct links should basically be changed from... http://whig.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~tsp93/path to http://www.soton.ac.uk/~tsp93ma/path There may be a few problems while I am moving things, and checking links. If you find any, please mail me and give me time. ===== Finally Hi! to everyone I met at the show! Tim ....@/ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 16 09:35:07 1995 Date: Sun, 15 Oct 1995 11:16:26 GMT From: "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." Message-Id: <11108@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: SAM BBS UK X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 3937 Lines: 86 =C4 Netmail (2:254/242.2) =C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4= =C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4 NETMAIL =C4 Msg : 20 of 20 Rcv Snt Pvt = From : Dave Whitmore 2:259/15.26 Thu 12 Oct 95 2= 3:06 To : Brian Gaff 254/242.2 = Subj : SAM BBS = =C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4= =C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4=C4 DALMATION BBS - 01744 614150 There is a new BBS for SAM users! Errm.. just one snag you might wonder.. SAM doesn't have comms capability y= et? One day soon, though we aren't sure when, software and comms interfaces that allow the use of off the shelf modems may be available. This, along with proposed hard drives will revolutionise everyones' perception of SAM. This will also mean that developers and enthusiasts will be able to communi= cate much faster and generally get things done quicker. We all know how frustrat= ing it can be to wait for letters and disks to arrive in the post.. If you already use a modem with your PC, Amiga or ST, then there's good new= s. Dalmation Bulletin Board Service will provide a choice of PD software, mess= age bases and have lots of other options too numerous (including ones we haven't even thought of yet!) to list here. To make things even more interesting, t= here will also be small machine specific areas. We will also listen to what members want from the service. We are open to a= ll ideas and suggestions. Co-sysop status is also available for the serious enthusiast. To start with, there are NO RATIOS. This means that you don't have to upload software, in order to download software. Uploads will always be very welcom= e and are generally encouraged. Many BBS's carry large sections of Spectrum Snapshots for use with Amiga's = and PC's. This will not be one of them, but we may offer SAM 128K conversions (subject to legality!). We must stress that this system is in its infancy. To start with it will be= a closed system, with local access only. In future, we may branch out to netw= orks such as FidoNet, but until there is a sufficient user base it remains close= d. So when's it on line then? It sounds bad when anyone says that a BBS is only available on one day a we= ek, but to start off, that's how it's going to be. The BBS will have strict ope= ning hours and initially be available on;- Saturdays 12 noon until 12 midnight. Starting on 21st October '95 (next weekend!) Depending on success, it will then be extended to Sundays, or the complete = 48 hours BT weekend rate period. After that, who knows? Sessions can always be arranged in advance, by voice phoning the Sysop, on = the same number, at any other time. Don't forget, you'll get a voice answer out= side these hours. Note: To be able to transfer SAM software between machines, you will need to work with PC(720k) disks. There are utilities that will help with the transfer. KE Disk, is widely available within the SAM PD scene. Commercial utilities such as PC_Suite are also recommended (though not essential). A special disk containing some utilities will hopefully be available for todays 5th Format show. Okay, all of this might sound eccentric, but what are we doing here in Qued= geley village hall anyway! :)) I look forward to seeing you. Dave Whitmore (Sysop Dalmation BBS) _ |_)ave (/\)hitmore >>> Dave.Whitmore.@259-15-26.conqueror.co.uk <<< FidoNet 2:259/15.26 -=3D0=3D- AmigaNet 39:131/6.26 -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 16 09:48:26 1995 Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 06:30:05 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11116@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: SAM BBS UK X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 81 Lines: 7 Oy, who made that message into a MIME one!! :-) Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From imc Mon Oct 16 11:23:08 1995 Subject: Re: CU tomorrow... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Mon, 16 Oct 95 11:23:08 BST In-Reply-To: <9510141406.AA21571@asmal.edh-net>; from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 14, 95 3:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 168 Lines: 8 On Sat, 14 Oct 1995 15:06:46 +0100, Frode Tenneboe said: > > What's that then? > Mickysoft and Windows 95. I was asking what it does, not what the product is... imc From imc Mon Oct 16 11:25:35 1995 Subject: Re: SAM BBS UK To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Mon, 16 Oct 95 11:25:35 BST In-Reply-To: <11108@bgserv.demon.co.uk>; from "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." at Oct 15, 95 11:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 444 Lines: 14 On Sun, 15 Oct 1995 11:16:26 GMT, Brian Gaff Sam Dept. said: [de-MIME-ised] > From : Dave Whitmore > There is a new BBS for SAM users! > This will also mean that developers and enthusiasts will be able to communicate > much faster and generally get things done quicker. We all know how frustrating > it can be to wait for letters and disks to arrive in the post.. We have a mailing list and an FTP site. What more do we need?... :-) imc From imc Mon Oct 16 11:42:18 1995 Subject: Re: SAM BBS UK To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Mon, 16 Oct 95 11:42:18 BST In-Reply-To: <11116@bgserv.demon.co.uk>; from "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." at Oct 16, 95 6:30 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 182 Lines: 6 On Mon, 16 Oct 1995 06:30:05 GMT, Brian Gaff Sam Dept. said: > Oy, who made that message into a MIME one!! I don't know, but perhaps you should give them a good telling off... imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 16 11:43:13 1995 Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 11:41:53 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510161041.AA26416@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: CU tomorrow... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 419 Lines: 14 > > > What's that then? > > > Mickysoft and Windows 95. > > I was asking what it does, not what the product is... That was not entirely clear from your question, was it? :) Well, _this_ year, win95 turned back the clock correctly if the machine was off during the period between 02-03. If it was on, it turned back the clock at 03, and when it became 03 again, it turned back again, and again, and..... :) -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 16 11:49:38 1995 From: insc4cgm@river.tay.ac.uk Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 11:45:25 +0100 Message-Id: <95101611452557@river.tay.ac.uk> To: SAM-USERS@nvg.unit.no Subject: EMail address change! X-Vms-To: SAM-USERS@NVG.UNIT.NO Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 317 Lines: 11 As of now, my email address has changed. Things are still a little screwed up here because they're switching servers, but, as far as I can tell, my new email address is INSC4CGM@RIVER.TAY.AC.UK If anyone has major problems, the old MCSCS3CGM will still be running for a few days at least. Thanks, Colin Macdonald From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 16 12:04:25 1995 Date: Mon, 16 Oct 95 11:05:31 PDT From: Stefan Drissen Subject: Re: CU tomorrow... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no X-Mailer: Chameleon - TCP/IP for Windows by NetManage, Inc. Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 769 Lines: 29 >On Fri, 13 Oct 95 15:27:35 PDT, Stefan Drissen said: > ^^^ > >> Due to you stupid British ********, your still on summertime (or daylight >> savings or whatever you want to call it) > >Well at least our mail shows the correct timezone... What timezone is PDT then? Isn't it the one for central Europe? Which England is NOT a part of! >> Next year the strange island inhabitants will have finally joined the rest of >> Europe with putting the clock backwards and forwards.... > >Says who? Some ruling body (or organ or commission or whatever) in the European Union does. Stefan Drissen aka Solar Flare of Entropy E-mail: drissen@pi.net S-mail: Zevende Herven 6, 5232 JZ 's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands T-mail: +31-73-414969 From imc Mon Oct 16 12:09:24 1995 Subject: Re: CU tomorrow... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Mon, 16 Oct 95 12:09:24 BST In-Reply-To: ; from "Stefan Drissen" at Oct 16, 95 11:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 323 Lines: 9 On Mon, 16 Oct 95 11:05:31 PDT, Stefan Drissen said: > What timezone is PDT then? Isn't it the one for central Europe? Which > England is NOT a part of! Fraid not. PDT is for the West coast of the USA (=GMT-7). You want MET, you do. Probably. I don't really know where the time zones stop and start in Europe. imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 16 12:12:22 1995 Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 12:10:52 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510161110.AA26430@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: How was.... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 32 Lines: 3 How was the show? Que? -Frode From imc Mon Oct 16 18:21:30 1995 Subject: Re: How was.... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Mon, 16 Oct 95 18:21:30 BST In-Reply-To: <9510161110.AA26430@asmal.edh-net>; from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 16, 95 12:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 809 Lines: 20 On Mon, 16 Oct 1995 12:10:52 +0100, Frode Tenneboe said: > How was the show? Average. Simon's accelerator seemed to have developed a slight problem during the car journey. It made the Sam go fast, but also made the screen almost unreadable. Colin's Quazar was there, but due to some rather awful speakers it sounded not quite as good as Stefan's SamDAC. Bob was there as usual, illegally selling Manic Miner... There were some rather loud T-shirts on the Fred stall. I bought a Currah uSpeech for 3 quid. :-) I saw Unc but he probably didn't recognise me... Various people went to the local afterwards, before I managed to cadge a lift to the station, whereupon the topic of conversation lowered somewhat to the attractive young woman with the huge... [Ahem!] > Que? Pardon? imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 16 19:02:19 1995 From: R J Partington Message-Id: <199510121028.LAA00229@heffer.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 11:28:07 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <9510120800.AA18858@asmal.edh-net> from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 12, 95 09:00:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1641 Lines: 45 Frode Tenneboe wrote... > > SOME of the drivers??? My guess is that you can junk around 70% of > everything that's in there. What is the point of having support for > Appleshare, 387 emulation, support for X number of filesystems, umsdos- > support, cd-rom (perhaps in the future? :), etc. Well, in my current kernel, all I have is IDE support, filesystems (msdos, minix,ext2), networking (slip,ppp) and a cdrom driver (because it's ATAPI, not standard IDE). My kernel is 334k compressed. No idea how big a minimal kernel is. > > I've got ArmLinux on my 4MB A5000 (Archimedes). That doesn't run at > > all... :( > > Minix ran on an 8086 with 640K. Ah, but Minix is a bit grotty (from what I've read/heard)... > > I'll be in it if people are going to give it a go... > > I might. If we do a propper design, we might be able to split > the thing up into parts that can be coded indvidually. Much like the original Linux... :) > Running X on a machine with only 4Mb is darn slow. I suffered this for exactly 3 days before I went to buy more memory. Mind you, the X server that comes with linux could probably be trimmed a bit... > I'd rather have multiple virtual terminals, You should see me trying to use DOS. Flailing wildly at the CTRL+ALT+Fx keys... > Forth for SAM - isn't that a step backwrds? :) In what sense? Small(ish) programs, 'dumpable' as executables, 'suspendable' if I can figure out how to do it cleanly. Someone wanted a text editor which could sit in high memory until called... I'm working on it, but it'll be written in FORTH if anything. Progress reports when I can get the bloody thing working...... Rob From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 16 19:40:27 1995 From: Colin G Piggot Date: Mon, 16 Oct 95 19:39:34 BST Message-Id: <2112.9510161839@pasta.st-andrews.ac.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: How was... Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 740 Lines: 16 Yup, I did have some dodgy speakers - only 2 Watts of power! I Had enough as it was to carry down on the train! The turnout at the show was rather crap anyway. You should hear the Quazar Surround with some decent speakers (100W !!!) Totally awesome! Colin Piggot __________________ __ ____ ___ ______________________ |Colin G Piggot | /| | | | | / | | |\ |(C) Colin G. Piggot | |cgp@st-and.ac.uk | / | | | |__| / |___| | \ |----------------------| | | / | | | | | / | | |__\ |*16* BIT SOUND STRIKES| |Presents The ... | / \ | |__| | | /___ | | | \ |THE SAM - HEARING IS | |_________________| /___\|=======SURROUND=======| \ |____________BELIEVING_| From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 09:32:14 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 09:22:36 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11145@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: SAM BBS UK X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 171 Lines: 8 I would hazard a guess that more people can access a BBs than Internet as yet. What we need is someone to send him all the stuff I guess. Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 09:34:06 1995 From: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Message-Id: <9510170813.AA29168@namu24.gwdg.de> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Cc: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Subject: Comm'ix 2.0 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 09:13:39 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 221 Lines: 11 Hi all !!! Now I have upload my new version of my Comm'ix terminal . This is for all Net User free ! You can test it ( at 19200 bps with a 14400 modem work fine ! ) I have upload Sam Paper 8 and 9 too . bye, Slawek. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 09:39:35 1995 Message-Id: <199510170832.JAA07788@willow.soton.ac.uk> Subject: The Show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no (Sam Coupe Mailing List) Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 09:32:26 +0100 (BST) From: "T.S.Paveley" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 806 Lines: 25 Hello! I thought Cookies Accelerator still looked fairly impressive, even if it was having some problems with the screen, the difference just 2MHz made to them poor lemmings. That was about the only new thing I looked at. Met lots of people, said hello, (IMC why didn't you say hello, I'm sure I used my deoderant that morning!) Ended up spending about #120 on the FRED Stand :-) I'm sure Colin Appreciated that. The nice lady at FORMAT asked me who Sad Snail Productions were, and why I didn't sub to FORMAT. Colin MacD bought a round in the pub, and I finally struggled all the way home with a nice monitor which is still sort of working! But it was fun! ....@/ -- Tim Paveley - Maths with Computer Science - University of Southampton Sam Coupe Web Pages: http://www.soton.ac.uk/~tsp93ma/Coupe/ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 09:47:38 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 09:44:38 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510170844.AA27179@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: How was.... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 910 Lines: 32 > On Mon, 16 Oct 1995 12:10:52 +0100, Frode Tenneboe said: > > How was the show? > > Average. Simon's accelerator seemed to have developed a slight problem > during the car journey. It made the Sam go fast, but also made the screen > almost unreadable. Colin's Quazar was there, but due to some rather awful Too bad. > speakers it sounded not quite as good as Stefan's SamDAC. Bob was there > as usual, illegally selling Manic Miner... There were some rather loud Illegally? > T-shirts on the Fred stall. I bought a Currah uSpeech for 3 quid. :-) > I saw Unc but he probably didn't recognise me... Who's Unc? > > Various people went to the local afterwards, before I managed to cadge a > lift to the station, whereupon the topic of conversation lowered somewhat > to the attractive young woman with the huge... [Ahem!] ..huge boyfriend? > > > Que? > > Pardon? C'est bon. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 09:59:21 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 09:58:35 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510170858.AA27190@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 2298 Lines: 65 > Frode Tenneboe wrote... > > > > SOME of the drivers??? My guess is that you can junk around 70% of > > everything that's in there. What is the point of having support for > > Appleshare, 387 emulation, support for X number of filesystems, umsdos- > > support, cd-rom (perhaps in the future? :), etc. > > Well, in my current kernel, all I have is IDE support, filesystems (msdos, > minix,ext2), networking (slip,ppp) and a cdrom driver (because it's ATAPI, > not standard IDE). My kernel is 334k compressed. No idea how big a minimal > kernel is. Striped and compiled with -O2? I've just heard about an Ultrix kernels < 256Kb. And don't forget that's compiled C. You _will_ get a smaller kernel if written in assembly..if feasable these days. > > > > I've got ArmLinux on my 4MB A5000 (Archimedes). That doesn't run at > > > all... :( > > > > Minix ran on an 8086 with 640K. > > Ah, but Minix is a bit grotty (from what I've read/heard)... But it's still (sort of) Unix. > > > > I'll be in it if people are going to give it a go... > > > > I might. If we do a propper design, we might be able to split > > the thing up into parts that can be coded indvidually. > > Much like the original Linux... :) Yeah. Well, most of the stuff was there before they split things into parts. It's very much of a one man job in there. > > > Running X on a machine with only 4Mb is darn slow. > > I suffered this for exactly 3 days before I went to buy more memory. Mind > you, the X server that comes with linux could probably be trimmed a bit... Ehm..it's based on FreeX86 you know.... > > > I'd rather have multiple virtual terminals, > > You should see me trying to use DOS. Flailing wildly at the CTRL+ALT+Fx > keys... > > > Forth for SAM - isn't that a step backwrds? :) > > In what sense? Small(ish) programs, 'dumpable' as executables, 'suspendable' > if I can figure out how to do it cleanly. Someone wanted a text editor which > could sit in high memory until called... I'm working on it, but it'll be > written in FORTH if anything. Progress reports when I can get the bloody > thing working...... Let me see...the last time I did anything in FORTH (7 years - but I guess there will never be an object FORTH? :), it was horrid with all the strange semantics and RPN :) -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 10:02:01 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 10:00:57 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510170900.AA27197@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: How was... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 498 Lines: 18 > Yup, I did have some dodgy speakers - only 2 Watts of power! I Had enough > as it was to carry down on the train! The turnout at the show was rather crap > anyway. Hey - arn't you a salesman? Have you heard about car/taxi? :) > > You should hear the Quazar Surround with some decent speakers (100W !!!) > Totally awesome! Perhaps you'd get better sales if you could show the potential? A bad demonstration is a lot worse than no demonstration (believe it or not!) > > Colin Piggot -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 10:05:09 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 10:04:14 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510170904.AA27200@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: SAM BBS UK X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 364 Lines: 13 > I would hazard a guess that more people can access a BBs than > Internet as yet. What we need is someone to send him all the > stuff I guess. You'd be amazed. My guess is that BBS's will go away, or survive as Internet providers. The problem with Internet is not that people can't access it, but where to find thing and how to look for it. > > Brian -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 10:30:42 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 10:28:36 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510170928.AA27210@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Comm'ix 2.0 X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 467 Lines: 19 > Hi all !!! > > Now I have upload my new version of my Comm'ix terminal . This is for all Net > User free ! > You can test it ( at 19200 bps with a 14400 modem work fine ! ) With the standard COMM-interface? > > I have upload Sam Paper 8 and 9 too . OK! I'll sort thing out at nvg as soon as I get my SAM up and running. It will be some day soon now, but exactly when is hard to tell. Right _now_ I don't have the time nor the space. :/ > Slawek. > -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 10:33:25 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 10:32:37 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510170932.AA27213@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: The Show X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 878 Lines: 31 > Hello! > > I thought Cookies Accelerator still looked fairly impressive, even if it > was having some problems with the screen, the difference just 2MHz made > to them poor lemmings. Remeber it's 33.3% faster - it's like upgrading a 25MHz PC to a 33MHz one. > > That was about the only new thing I looked at. Met lots of people, said > hello, (IMC why didn't you say hello, I'm sure I used my deoderant that > morning!) > > Ended up spending about #120 on the FRED Stand :-) I'm sure Colin > Appreciated that. The nice lady at FORMAT asked me who Sad Snail > Productions were, and why I didn't sub to FORMAT. That was Jenny, wasn't it? > > Colin MacD bought a round in the pub, and I finally struggled all the > way home with a nice monitor which is still sort of working! He probably could afford it with your contribution? :) > > But it was fun! *sob* -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 11:05:10 1995 From: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Message-Id: <9510171003.AA30202@namu24.gwdg.de> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Cc: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Subject: Re: Comm'ix 2.0 In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 17 Oct 95 10:28:36 +0100." <9510170928.AA27210@asmal.edh-net> Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 11:03:53 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 362 Lines: 13 >> Now I have upload my new version of my Comm'ix terminal . This is for all Net >> User free ! >> You can test it ( at 19200 bps with a 14400 modem work fine ! )>>> > >With the standard COMM-interface? Yes , You must ONLY remove the pin 7 ( I think ) DTR and connect it to pin 4 ( I think ) RTS and You must only write to Your modem at&d0 . bye , Slawek. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 11:30:22 1995 Message-Id: <199510171027.LAA05652@sgi1.york.ac.uk> From: gaw2@mailer.york.ac.uk (Mars Bar) Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 11:27:05 +0100 In-Reply-To: ft -- "Re: The Show" (Oct 17, 10:32am) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT)) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: The Show Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1019 Lines: 27 On Oct 17, 10:32am in "Re: The Show", warbled: [quoting someone else...] ] > I thought Cookies Accelerator still looked fairly impressive, even if it ] > was having some problems with the screen, the difference just 2MHz made ] > to them poor lemmings. Hmm. 2MHz isn't actually right. We were clocking the Sam at 10. ] Remeber it's 33.3% faster - it's like upgrading a 25MHz PC to a 33MHz one. And since the poor Sam usually only shoves out around 5MHz, we'd got it going twice as fast. And the girl with the huge ....... was Jenny's daughter, or so Simon reliably (if he's done anything reliably in his life ;-) informs me. He's probably not on the list atm because he was coming down with the worst flu I have ever seen, and I expect (after 8 hours in the car and 7 at the show with him) that I shall have it in a couple of days. I certainly have what appears to be the beginnings of a sore throat... *sigh* The accelerator is nice though. Much nicer when you don't have the problem with the screen... Geoff From imc Tue Oct 17 11:52:29 1995 Subject: Re: SAM BBS UK To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 11:52:29 BST In-Reply-To: <11145@bgserv.demon.co.uk>; from "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." at Oct 17, 95 9:22 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 410 Lines: 12 On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 09:22:36 GMT, Brian Gaff Sam Dept. said: ^^^ [blah] We haven't moved on to GMT yet - that's next weekend... (The reason why it matters is because putting the wrong timezone on alters the date by an hour (or several hours if you put PDT) and since my mailer sorts by date it then puts the mails in the wrong order and I receive answers before questions). imc From imc Tue Oct 17 11:58:03 1995 Subject: Re: The Show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 11:58:03 BST In-Reply-To: <199510170832.JAA07788@willow.soton.ac.uk>; from "T.S.Paveley" at Oct 17, 95 9:32 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 302 Lines: 8 On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 09:32:26 +0100 (BST), T.S.Paveley said: > That was about the only new thing I looked at. Met lots of people, said > hello, (IMC why didn't you say hello, I'm sure I used my deoderant that > morning!) I probably didn't know what to say as I'm a shy kind of chap really... :-) imc From imc Tue Oct 17 12:00:43 1995 Subject: Re: How was.... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 12:00:43 BST In-Reply-To: <9510170844.AA27179@asmal.edh-net>; from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 17, 95 9:44 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 398 Lines: 11 On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 09:44:38 +0100, Frode Tenneboe said: > > Bob was there > > as usual, illegally selling Manic Miner... > Illegally? I don't know the full story, but apparently Phoenix has the exclusive rights to sell the Sam Manic Miner (and Sound Machine), so David Ledbury got rather annoyed when he saw a copy on Bob's stall. imc From imc Tue Oct 17 12:02:55 1995 Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 12:02:55 BST In-Reply-To: <9510170858.AA27190@asmal.edh-net>; from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 17, 95 9:58 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 407 Lines: 11 On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 09:58:35 +0100, Frode Tenneboe said: > Let me see...the last time I did anything in FORTH (7 years - but I guess > there will never be an object FORTH? :), it was horrid with all the > strange semantics and RPN :) It's not all that bad when you are used to it. But the beauty of Forth is that it is extremely easy to compile and goes moderately fast (compared to BASIC anyway). imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 12:03:47 1995 From: Mr Andrew M Gale Message-Id: <9510171101.AA10160@central.surrey.ac.uk> Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 12:01:51 BST In-Reply-To: <9510170858.AA27190@asmal.edh-net>; from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 17, 95 9:58 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 48 Lines: 2 And what is wrong with RPN? It's very nice.... From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 12:11:46 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 12:10:11 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510171110.AA27400@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: The Show X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1181 Lines: 31 > On Oct 17, 10:32am in "Re: The Show", warbled: > [quoting someone else...] > ] > I thought Cookies Accelerator still looked fairly impressive, even if it > ] > was having some problems with the screen, the difference just 2MHz made > ] > to them poor lemmings. > > Hmm. 2MHz isn't actually right. We were clocking the Sam at 10. > > ] Remeber it's 33.3% faster - it's like upgrading a 25MHz PC to a 33MHz one. > > And since the poor Sam usually only shoves out around 5MHz, we'd got it > going twice as fast. OK! Like upgrading a 33MHz PC to a 66MHz then.... > > And the girl with the huge ....... was Jenny's daughter, or so Simon > reliably (if he's done anything reliably in his life ;-) informs me. He's > probably not on the list atm because he was coming down with the worst > flu I have ever seen, and I expect (after 8 hours in the car and 7 at the > show with him) that I shall have it in a couple of days. I certainly have > what appears to be the beginnings of a sore throat... Have you tried inhaling raw chilli through your nose and drinking scolding milk with black pepper and honey? Guaranteed to wipe every bacteria away for good! :) > Geoff > -Frode From imc Tue Oct 17 12:14:28 1995 Subject: Re: The Show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 12:14:28 BST In-Reply-To: <9510171110.AA27400@asmal.edh-net>; from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 17, 95 12:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 282 Lines: 8 On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 12:10:11 +0100, Frode Tenneboe said: > Have you tried inhaling raw chilli through your nose and drinking > scolding milk with black pepper and honey? Guaranteed to wipe every > bacteria away for good! :) That's good... except flu is caused by a virus! :-) imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 12:20:35 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 12:18:58 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510171118.AA27429@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 223 Lines: 8 > And what is wrong with RPN? It's very nice.... Not at the age of 15. :) And I still don't like it when programming high-level. Low level is ok, because it's on a different abstraction level. Simple enough. :) -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 12:41:44 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 12:38:08 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510171138.AA27442@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: The Show X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 410 Lines: 11 > On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 12:10:11 +0100, Frode Tenneboe said: > > Have you tried inhaling raw chilli through your nose and drinking > > scolding milk with black pepper and honey? Guaranteed to wipe every > > bacteria away for good! :) > > That's good... except flu is caused by a virus! :-) Ah! You'r in the pedantic moode, eh? Well, you can hardly get a flu from _a_ virus, you need many virus_es_ ;) -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 12:43:14 1995 Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 12:36:05 +0100 From: ft@edh.ericsson.se (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510171136.AA27439@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 448 Lines: 13 > On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 09:58:35 +0100, Frode Tenneboe said: > > > Let me see...the last time I did anything in FORTH (7 years - but I guess > > there will never be an object FORTH? :), it was horrid with all the > > strange semantics and RPN :) > > It's not all that bad when you are used to it. But the beauty of Forth is > that it is extremely easy to compile and goes moderately fast (compared to > BASIC anyway). No objections. :) -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 13:34:02 1995 Message-Id: <199510171228.NAA26414@willow.soton.ac.uk> Subject: Re: The Show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 13:28:26 +0100 (BST) From: "T.S.Paveley" In-Reply-To: <9510171058.AA02671@booth5.ecs.ox.ac.uk> from "Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk" at Oct 17, 95 11:58:03 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 757 Lines: 22 To quote Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk: @/ On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 09:32:26 +0100 (BST), T.S.Paveley said: @/ > That was about the only new thing I looked at. Met lots of people, said @/ > hello, (IMC why didn't you say hello, I'm sure I used my deoderant that @/ > morning!) @/ @/ I probably didn't know what to say as I'm a shy kind of chap really... :-) @/ @/ imc @/ Aww, I didn't realise I was that scary. Actually I think I saw you, you were with your little bruv yes? I almost said something but chickened out as well. I keep doing that, oh well, stefen got a hello out of me this time, so I am improving :-) ....@/ -- Tim Paveley - Maths with Computer Science - University of Southampton Sam Coupe Web Pages: http://www.soton.ac.uk/~tsp93ma/Coupe/ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 17 15:09:32 1995 From: L.Willis@comp.brad.ac.uk Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 15:07:54 +0100 Message-Id: <14499.199510171407@dcsun4.comp.brad.ac.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: The Show X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 597 Lines: 21 Tim Paveley said ; > I thought Cookies Accelerator still looked fairly impressive, even if it > was having some problems with the screen, the difference just 2MHz made > to them poor lemmings. Yeah, it was like Lemmings on speed! > Colin MacD bought a round in the pub, and I finally struggled all the MacD buying a round, now that's something you don't see very often, CHEERS COLIN! > way home with a nice monitor which is still sort of working! 'Sort of working'? The colour was dodgy, and there was no sound, but hey I suppose that's not too bad! Lee 'Bubel' Willis From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 18 04:19:11 1995 Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 21:16:41 GMT From: "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." Message-Id: <11098@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Samulator? X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 172 Lines: 8 Has anyone out there thought of writing one for the PC or any other platform. Gerton doubts it is possible due to the Line interrupts etc. Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 18 07:18:49 1995 Date: Wed, 18 Oct 1995 06:58:56 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11176@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Comm'ix 2.0 X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 204 Lines: 8 But AT&D0 is needed on the interface as it stands. What about the dodgy UART buffer caused by the higher voltage on the chip where the last char in does not always clear? Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 18 07:18:50 1995 Date: Wed, 18 Oct 1995 07:01:46 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11177@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: How was.... X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 122 Lines: 7 Bob maintains the Manic Miners he has are already paud for and he is just selling stock. Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 18 09:42:10 1995 From: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Message-Id: <9510180841.AA14935@namu26.gwdg.de> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Cc: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Subject: Re: Comm'ix 2.0 In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 18 Oct 95 06:58:56 GMT." <11176@bgserv.demon.co.uk> Date: Wed, 18 Oct 95 09:41:09 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 453 Lines: 12 >But AT&D0 is needed on the interface as it stands. What about >the dodgy UART buffer caused by the higher voltage on the chip >where the last char in does not always clear? > >Brian > >-- >Brian Gaff Sam Dept. I don't really understand , what You mean , but I can say that , when a char come , than UART send a interrupt to Sam and my proggie will be interrupted and get this char and put it into a bufor . And on this way You don't lost any char From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 18 12:14:43 1995 From: R J Partington Message-Id: <199510171226.NAA00554@heffer.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 13:26:35 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <9510170858.AA27190@asmal.edh-net> from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 17, 95 09:58:35 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1216 Lines: 35 Frode Tenneboe wrote... > > Striped and compiled with -O2? It's compiled with -O2, but not sure if it's stripped. The compressed version (with gzip -9) is 334852. > I've just heard about an Ultrix kernels < 256Kb. The MACH kernel is even smaller than that, but it doesn't _do_ very much on it's own. > And don't forget that's compiled C. You _will_ get a smaller kernel > if written in assembly..if feasable these days. Should be feasible. Best thing to do would be to get a Z80 targetted GCC, compile to assembly, then hand that over to our resident bit-twiddlers. You get all the hard work done, but you can still human-tweak the code. > > I suffered this for exactly 3 days before I went to buy more memory. Mind > > you, the X server that comes with linux could probably be trimmed a bit... > > Ehm..it's based on FreeX86 you know.... Yes, and? > Let me see...the last time I did anything in FORTH (7 years - but I guess > there will never be an object FORTH? :), it was horrid with all the You can get object oriented FORTH. I think TILE-FORTH (AFAIK it's the official GNU forth) supports object orientation. I'm not sure _how_ because I've kept a safe distance from OOP -- until yesterday :( Rob From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 18 13:20:20 1995 Message-Id: <199510181208.NAA13363@sgi20.york.ac.uk> From: gaw2@mailer.york.ac.uk (Mars Bar) Date: Wed, 18 Oct 1995 13:08:20 +0100 In-Reply-To: Briansam -- "Re: How was...." (Oct 18, 7:01am) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT)) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: How was.... Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 500 Lines: 13 On Oct 18, 7:01am in "Re: How was....", warbled: ] Bob maintains the Manic Miners he has are already paud for and ] he is just selling stock. And everyone else maintains that Bob is pirating copies. No-one really knows, no-one (except Dave L) really cares, and since Bob has now reached the sad point where he's trying to sell copies of SamDos v2 for a fiver (anyone out there not got a copy on every disk, except the Masterdos ones?) I really don't think we have to guess who's lying. G. Geoff From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 18 17:06:47 1995 From: Diggory Gray Organization: The University of Birmingham To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 18 Oct 1995 17:02:05 GMT Subject: Hello. Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Message-Id: <33D6F25F54@novell3.bham.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 92 Lines: 3 Is any body studying in Birmingham uni. are near there? Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 18 22:14:46 1995 From: Si Owen Message-Id: <199510180843.JAA00491@obobo.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: Samulator? To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 18 Oct 1995 09:43:39 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <11098@bgserv.demon.co.uk> from "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." at Oct 13, 95 09:16:41 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 884 Lines: 21 Brian Gaff Sam Dept. wrote: > > Has anyone out there thought of writing one for the PC or any > other platform. Gerton doubts it is possible due to the Line > interrupts etc. > We're not expecting perfect emulation with line interrupts, and the extra processing needed for the more complicated display modes. It would be nice just to be able to do *something* on it :-) My monitor TurboMON only ran at 1/50th of Sam speed, and only minimally handled line interrupts, but it was still of some use... Please Gerton, anything would be better than nothing! Si +------------------------------------+----------------------------------------+ | Si Owen | Email: si@obobo.demon.co.uk | | Wordcraft International Ltd, UK | Fax: +44-1332-295525 | +------------------------------------+----------------------------------------+ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 19 13:46:54 1995 From: Diggory Gray Organization: The University of Birmingham To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 11:48:08 GMT Subject: A Galaxy Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Message-Id: <469BCD287B@novell3.bham.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 378 Lines: 9 Here is a galaxy in BMP format, but SAM resolution. If any wishes to know, I drew it on SAM Paint. When I went to the SAM&Speccy show last year they had an Amiga set up which was emulating a Speccy. I talked to the people on the stand and they said some one was working on a SAM emulator for the Amiga, I think thats what he said anyway. Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 19 14:00:17 1995 From: Diggory Gray Organization: The University of Birmingham To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 12:02:53 GMT Subject: Forgotten to attach the picy... Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Message-Id: <46DB5B0223@novell3.bham.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 85 Lines: 3 Sorry I forgot to attach the picy. So here it is. Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 19 14:00:29 1995 Message-Id: <21857.9510191136@rs6-233.cls-4.bcc.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Forgotten to attach the picy... To: DJG528@novell3.bham.ac.uk Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 12:36:38 +0100 (BST) From: Mr Keith Turner Cc: sam-users@nvg.unit.no In-Reply-To: <46DADB04D6@novell3.bham.ac.uk> from "Diggory Gray" at Oct 19, 95 12:02:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 527 Lines: 13 Dear Diggory, Please don't mail binary files to the mailing list. It is much less anti-social to offer to mail them to interested people. Remember, a lot of people pay money to read e-mail, in phone bills and service provider charges. / begin 660 galaxy.bmp > M0DUV8````````'8````H``````$``,`````!``0````````````````````` > M````````````````````@```@````("``(````"``(``@(```("`@`#`P,`` > M``#_``#_````__\`_P```/\`_P#__P``____`````````````'`````````` > M``````````````````````````````````````````````````0```\````` From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 19 14:00:30 1995 Message-Id: <199510191121.MAA30558@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 12:20:19 +0100 (BST) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 596 Lines: 18 Hi all... I'm finally back in the thick of things after being in bed with flu for most of the week... now I've got to catch up with the emails - and the lecture notes :( Anyway... Quick note about Comm'ix 2.0: I still have the same crashes which I had with the old version... so what's so good about the new version? No matter which combination of masterdos / samdos / masterbasic I use, the file handling DOESN'T WORK!!!!! It just bombs out of the menu, back to the main selection screen. Other than that, nice to see my ol' Star Trek sample demo converted to Polish on SAMPaper 9 :) Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 19 14:00:39 1995 From: Si Owen Message-Id: <199510191004.LAA00943@obobo.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: Hello To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 11:04:25 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <33D6F25F54@novell3.bham.ac.uk> from "Diggory Gray" at Oct 18, 95 05:02:05 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 453 Lines: 13 Diggory Gray wrote: > > Is any body studying in Birmingham uni. are near there? > I'm in Nottingham... only 45 minutes away! Si +------------------------------------+----------------------------------------+ | Si Owen | Email: si@obobo.demon.co.uk | | Wordcraft International Ltd, UK | Fax: +44-1332-295525 | +------------------------------------+----------------------------------------+ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 19 14:06:39 1995 Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 13:19:35 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510191219.AA02622@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Forgotten to attach the picy... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 177 Lines: 9 > Sorry I forgot to attach the picy. > So here it is. No, it wasn't! But don't post it either - upload it to ftp.nvg.unit.no! > Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) > -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 19 15:08:07 1995 From: Diggory Gray Organization: The University of Birmingham To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 15:01:48 GMT Subject: Re: Forgotten to attach the picy... Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Message-Id: <49D6060A36@novell3.bham.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 102 Lines: 3 Do you want a picture of a galaxy? Some people reckon they got it. Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 19 16:14:29 1995 Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 15:25:40 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510191425.AA02862@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Forgotten to attach the picy... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 243 Lines: 10 > Do you want a picture of a galaxy? > Some people reckon they got it. It has been posted to this group already, but, for the future, _don't do that_!!!! Upload it to ftp.nvg.unit.no in stead. > Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) > -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 20 08:35:15 1995 Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 07:01:11 GMT From: "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." Message-Id: <11220@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Forgotten to attach the picy... X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 198 Lines: 8 Could we refrain from putting bonaries here please? Just upload them somewhere and let those who require them, get them. We are not all on a free service you know!! Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 20 09:06:40 1995 Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 08:33:10 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510200733.AA03195@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1731 Lines: 49 > > Striped and compiled with -O2? > > It's compiled with -O2, but not sure if it's stripped. The compressed > version (with gzip -9) is 334852. I can tell that you have a lot of disc space... :) > > > I've just heard about an Ultrix kernels < 256Kb. > > The MACH kernel is even smaller than that, but it doesn't _do_ very > much on it's own. Hmm...the SAM-kernel is even smaller than that. ;) > > > And don't forget that's compiled C. You _will_ get a smaller kernel > > if written in assembly..if feasable these days. > > Should be feasible. Best thing to do would be to get a Z80 targetted > GCC, compile to assembly, then hand that over to our resident bit-twiddlers. > You get all the hard work done, but you can still human-tweak the code. Have thought of that too. The question is, do we target it for a ordinary SAM (would still be possible) or the Accelrated SAM? > > > > I suffered this for exactly 3 days before I went to buy more memory. Mind > > > you, the X server that comes with linux could probably be trimmed a bit... > > > > Ehm..it's based on FreeX86 you know.... > > Yes, and? Depends on how you define 'trim' :) To make it portable, it has to be more or less generic meaning that you can probably trim for a set of graphics cards, but then it won't work on another set. > > > Let me see...the last time I did anything in FORTH (7 years - but I guess > > there will never be an object FORTH? :), it was horrid with all the > > You can get object oriented FORTH. I think TILE-FORTH (AFAIK it's the > official GNU forth) supports object orientation. I'm not sure _how_ > because I've kept a safe distance from OOP -- until yesterday :( I didn't know that.... -Frode...have to run..meeting. From imc Fri Oct 20 11:38:17 1995 Subject: Re: Samulator? To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 20 Oct 95 11:38:17 BST In-Reply-To: <11098@bgserv.demon.co.uk>; from "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." at Oct 13, 95 9:16 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 215 Lines: 7 On Fri, 13 Oct 1995 21:16:41 GMT, Brian Gaff Sam Dept. said: > Has anyone out there thought of writing one for the PC or any > other platform. Allan was working on one (or is that supposed to be a secret?)... imc From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 20 13:05:44 1995 Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 12:44:56 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510201144.AA03286@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Samulator? X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 311 Lines: 10 > On Fri, 13 Oct 1995 21:16:41 GMT, Brian Gaff Sam Dept. said: > > Has anyone out there thought of writing one for the PC or any > > other platform. > > Allan was working on one (or is that supposed to be a secret?)... Didn't he bring along a sneak preview of a project he's working on to the show? -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 20 14:00:18 1995 From: Diggory Gray Organization: The University of Birmingham To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 13:54:01 GMT Subject: Re: Forgotten to attach the picy... Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.22 Message-Id: <60B6C353B8@novell3.bham.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 197 Lines: 5 Sorry about the picture! I had no idea that such files are so agrevating for people. The second message about 'the picture' was a mistake so please ignore that.Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 20 19:31:11 1995 From: R J Partington Message-Id: <199510201143.MAA00307@heffer.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 12:43:43 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <9510200733.AA03195@asmal.edh-net> from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 20, 95 08:33:10 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1097 Lines: 28 Frode Tenneboe wrote... > > I can tell that you have a lot of disc space... :) Quick df of linux partitions: total: 957514, left 574052, used 383462 :) Mind you, that does include _huge_ amounts of unpacked archives of programs like WINE, xfig, big things like that. (I forgot! Netscape... 3M statically linked binary. Dontcha just love Motif programs... :) > > [c->asm] > Have thought of that too. The question is, do we target it for a > ordinary SAM (would still be possible) or the Accelrated SAM? Well, I'm using a DX2/66 with 8MB memory and I _still_ find that linux is straining (usually compiling or running X). I'd say wait to see how the accelerator turns out, then probably target it for that. If people _really_ want to run it on a basic SAM, > Depends on how you define 'trim' :) To make it portable, it has to be > more or less generic meaning that you can probably trim for a set of > graphics cards, but then it won't work on another set. True, but I've only got one graphics card in this machine... :) Rob ...don't have to run...boss hasn't contacted me in a week... :) From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Sat Oct 21 17:22:15 1995 From: Si Owen Message-Id: <199510211106.MAA00356@obobo.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Sat, 21 Oct 1995 12:06:19 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <199510201143.MAA00307@heffer.demon.co.uk> from "R J Partington" at Oct 20, 95 12:43:43 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1002 Lines: 21 R J Partington wrote: > > Well, I'm using a DX2/66 with 8MB memory and I _still_ find that linux > is straining (usually compiling or running X). Running X and compiling just starts to eat into my swap-space, and I've got 16M RAM. Not really the right group for this, but things are MUCH faster when you upgrade your RAM. Even just starting X with 8MB it thrashes far too much. I image we can get a command-line only Linux up and running (is X support even considered?), with minimal daemons running. Even just running bourne shell eats over 300K of memory on my machine! Also, doesn't the way Sam pages it's memory make things more difficult compared to other platforms? Si +------------------------------------+----------------------------------------+ | Si Owen | Email: si@obobo.demon.co.uk | | Wordcraft International Ltd, UK | Fax: +44-1332-295525 | +------------------------------------+----------------------------------------+ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Sun Oct 22 17:36:15 1995 Date: Sun, 22 Oct 1995 09:37:14 GMT From: "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." Message-Id: <11251@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: 16Mhz Z80 based Amstrad X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 171 Lines: 9 This new PCW16 in using this chip, MAY bring the chip cost dowb, do you think?? Maybe its cos its cheap that Amstrad are doing it... :-) Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 23 04:52:30 1995 Date: Sun, 22 Oct 1995 06:53:54 GMT From: "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." Message-Id: <11239@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Forgotten to attach the picy... X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 303 Lines: 11 Well, the picture UUENCODED has such an overhead, thats the problem. When you consider its probably not wanted by most of us, it is rather like posting it to a newsgroup. I think many will get sensitive to this kind of thing as they start paying for access themselves! Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 23 08:04:36 1995 Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 08:40:13 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510230740.AA04562@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Samulator? X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 725 Lines: 25 > Brian Gaff Sam Dept. wrote: > > > > Has anyone out there thought of writing one for the PC or any > > other platform. Gerton doubts it is possible due to the Line > > interrupts etc. > > > > We're not expecting perfect emulation with line interrupts, and the extra > processing needed for the more complicated display modes. It would be nice > just to be able to do *something* on it :-) My monitor TurboMON only ran at > 1/50th of Sam speed, and only minimally handled line interrupts, but it was > still of some use... I wouldn't rule it out as impossible :) > > Please Gerton, anything would be better than nothing! He's not on this list :) Besides, he's in..eh...South America I believe... > > Si -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 23 08:05:25 1995 Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 08:45:04 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510230745.AA04569@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: linux, FreeBSD etc X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 555 Lines: 17 > R J Partington wrote: > > > > Well, I'm using a DX2/66 with 8MB memory and I _still_ find that linux > > is straining (usually compiling or running X). > > Running X and compiling just starts to eat into my swap-space, and I've > got 16M RAM. Not really the right group for this, but things are MUCH faster > when you upgrade your RAM. Even just starting X with 8MB it thrashes far too > much. Adding memory without adding cache makes everything run slower! The same effect will occure if you don't add swap-space at the same time. > Si > -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 23 08:15:32 1995 From: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Message-Id: <9510230814.AA09155@namu23.gwdg.de> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Cc: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 19 Oct 95 12:20:19 +0100." <199510191121.MAA30558@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Date: Mon, 23 Oct 95 09:14:15 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 517 Lines: 12 >Quick note about Comm'ix 2.0: I still have the same crashes which I had with >the old version... so what's so good about the new version? No matter which >combination of masterdos / samdos / masterbasic I use, the file handling >DOESN'T WORK!!!!! It just bombs out of the menu, back to the main selection >screen. I use only masterdos without masterbasic ( it is really sooo good ... ) and all work great . I think that the file handling will won't work only on Your Sam Simon ( sorry about that .... ) Slawek. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 23 08:35:13 1995 From: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Message-Id: <9510230834.AA09273@namu23.gwdg.de> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Cc: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Subject: Comm'ix bugs Date: Mon, 23 Oct 95 09:34:02 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 569 Lines: 14 Hi Simon , Can You write my what see the ' file handling bug ' on Your Sam . That was I change in version 2.0 is not file handling , but terminal speed , now work that interrupt controlled wothout less of any char and that can You see too or ... ? What is with Your Termite ? When Your program is better as mine , why we can see this in a very tiny sharware or PD version . I will see , what won't work on Your program too ... Slawek. P.S.:SAMPaper is a very old polish Sam magazine and all things on it are old too , but no one will upload anything to nvg... From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 23 09:43:36 1995 Message-Id: <199510230942.KAA07620@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 09:41:49 +0000 (GMT) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510230814.AA09155@namu23.gwdg.de> from "slawek@namu01.gwdg.de" at Oct 23, 95 09:14:15 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1026 Lines: 23 > > >Quick note about Comm'ix 2.0: I still have the same crashes which I had with > >the old version... so what's so good about the new version? No matter which > >combination of masterdos / samdos / masterbasic I use, the file handling > >DOESN'T WORK!!!!! It just bombs out of the menu, back to the main selection > >screen. > > I use only masterdos without masterbasic ( it is really sooo good ... ) and all > work great . > I think that the file handling will won't work only on Your Sam Simon ( sorry > about that .... ) Which version ROM do you have? I've tried it on two SAMs now (both mine & Martin Rookyards) with versions 2.1 and 2.3 of MasterDOS... both of which crash out if you select load file (a random character is printed in the top left of the file window, and the file window disappears - incredibly quickly too). Also, some VT100 codes seem to crash it - which is probably my fault for logging into a UNIX box.. BTW: I've not tried it on a 256k sam yet, but that shouldn't make a difference. Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 23 10:33:06 1995 Message-Id: <9510231032.AA02971@dxmint.cern.ch> From: Allan Skillman (Dr Kid) Subject: Driver Mines To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Mon, 23 Oct 95 11:32:00 MET Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 483 Lines: 12 Hello everyone, Well after a weeks break (to recover from the show NOT!) I'm back on line. As promised I'm uploading the beta version of my mines game for Driver to nvg. Look for Dmines.pak in the incoming directory. Just load it in at addr 32000 cal CALL 32000 to unpack. This should write a Driver Application file to disk. Just load Driver and double click away. Any comments /suggestions are welcome. On the subject of emulators I'll just say - watch this space - :) Allan -- From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Mon Oct 23 14:09:09 1995 Message-Id: From: Andrew M Gale Subject: PCW16 To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 13:48:20 +0000 (GMT) In-Reply-To: <9510231032.AA02971@dxmint.cern.ch> from "Allan Skillman" at Oct 23, 95 11:32:00 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 205 Lines: 5 what's this new Amstrad then? Is it basically just a PCW9512 with a faster processor? Think of all the talented SAM z80 coders who could make a packet if they got their mitts on one of these machines.... From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 07:08:32 1995 Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 06:47:41 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11303@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Samulator? X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 125 Lines: 9 Gerton is in Honduras. I think he is having his work cut out with working for a living :-) Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 07:08:32 1995 Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 06:50:12 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11304@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: PCW16 X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 498 Lines: 14 In message Andrew M Gale writes: > what's this new Amstrad then? Is it basically just > a PCW9512 with a faster processor? Think of all the > talented SAM z80 coders who could make a packet if they > got their mitts on one of these machines.... > > The details are on the amstrad 8bit group. I read it as an MC100 wuth a VGA mono screen and a fast processir. As far as I can tell it cannot run CP/M all software is in ROM. Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 09:08:27 1995 From: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Message-Id: <9510240849.AA18819@namu23.gwdg.de> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Cc: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 23 Oct 95 09:41:49 GMT." <199510230942.KAA07620@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Date: Tue, 24 Oct 95 09:49:21 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1210 Lines: 27 >Which version ROM do you have? I've tried it on two SAMs now (both mine & >Martin Rookyards) with versions 2.1 and 2.3 of MasterDOS... both of which >crash out if you select load file (a random character is printed in the top >left of the file window, and the file window disappears - incredibly >quickly too). Also, some VT100 codes seem to crash it - which is probably my >fault for logging into a UNIX box.. I have the new version of ROM ( I think 3.0 or so ) and MasterDos 2.4 , but I don't use MasterBasic ( sic ... ) . I have tested for You my program with MasterBasic v1.0 and I find the bug . My program fonts are placed at the end of Sam's RAM , but MasterBasic will use this area for they things . I don't say that my terminal can work with TV100 codes , Comm'ix have ONLY implemented ANSI codes , but not all ... Also You have right , that was no fault at the side of my program ... Now I have placed my fonts at RAM before DOS and these don't be corrupt when You will load or save files , but load and save allone ( with MB too ) work allways ... bye , Slawek. P.S.: I don't know or my program work with SamDos ... P.S.: I upload the bug-free version to nvg... with name commix201.td0 From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 09:52:30 1995 Message-Id: <199510240950.KAA20521@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 09:50:24 +0000 (GMT) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510240849.AA18819@namu23.gwdg.de> from "slawek@namu01.gwdg.de" at Oct 24, 95 09:49:21 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1514 Lines: 38 > I have the new version of ROM ( I think 3.0 or so ) and MasterDos 2.4 , but I > don't use MasterBasic ( sic ... ) . > I have tested for You my program with MasterBasic v1.0 and I find the bug . My > program fonts are placed at the end of Sam's RAM , but MasterBasic will use this > area for they things . I keep wondering about this MasterDOS v2.4 that I keep seeing all over the place. What is it? I've got the source code for the last version of MasterDOS released, direct from Dr. Andy Wright, and it's version 2.3... so where has version 2.4 come from? > I don't say that my terminal can work with TV100 codes , Comm'ix have ONLY > implemented ANSI codes , but not all ... Also You have right , that was no fault > at the side of my program ... But even if the VT100 codes come through, it SHOULDN'T LOCK UP like it does. If an invalid code comes in, you should just discard it and ignore it - not crash the system! I think it's the application mode codes that do it (the ones that change a keypad on a VT100 from being cursor keys to giving ascii numerals back). > Now I have placed my fonts at RAM before DOS and these don't be corrupt when You > will load or save files , but load and save allone ( with MB too ) work allways > ... > > bye , > > Slawek. > > P.S.: I don't know or my program work with SamDos ... > P.S.: I upload the bug-free version to nvg... with name commix201.td0 I'll try it out and see what I come up with bug-wise then. With a bit of luck it'll be okay now. Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 09:54:34 1995 Message-Id: <199510240953.KAA20577@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Comm'ix bugs To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 09:53:28 +0000 (GMT) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510230834.AA09273@namu23.gwdg.de> from "slawek@namu01.gwdg.de" at Oct 23, 95 09:34:02 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 863 Lines: 23 > What is with Your Termite ? When Your program is better as mine , why we can see > this in a very tiny sharware or PD version . I will see , what won't work on > Your program too ... Fine by me... the only problem is that while most of the code is now in a form that I can use it, there's no front end. Also, I'm not happy with the speed of the display - while it is faster than BASIC, and also faster than Prodos, it could still be improved. I need to recode most of the stuff to work within my memory management frameworks as well. Not to mention the fact that I'm working pretty much full-time now too. > Slawek. > > P.S.:SAMPaper is a very old polish Sam magazine and all things on it are old too > , but no one will upload anything to nvg... I do !!!! :) Simon ps Please upload some more copies of SAMPaper.. it's nice to see what's on there... From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 10:15:39 1995 From: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Message-Id: <9510241015.AA17285@namu23.gwdg.de> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Cc: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 24 Oct 95 09:50:24 GMT." <199510240950.KAA20521@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Date: Tue, 24 Oct 95 11:15:14 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 477 Lines: 16 ... 1. MasterDos 2.4 I have got this from a friend of me , but that work as version 2.3 2. Can You say me what of VT100 code make a crash , when You know it ? When You will , I have a 40 min time and we can speak about my and Your terminal on IRC or throught telnet ? bye , Slawek. P.S.: I have upload a SamPaper 6 to nvg ( this is the last , that I have ) . I can upload turbo PD disks . I have Enceladus , Public and Arcadia , but I don't know is this PD or not ? From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 11:08:26 1995 Message-Id: <199510241107.MAA21466@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Driver Mines... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 11:06:50 +0000 (GMT) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 93 Lines: 7 Hi Allan... Erm... the file's up there, but it has a length of zero bytes... *gulp* Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 11:10:02 1995 Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 11:28:35 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510241028.AA15535@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 244 Lines: 8 > P.S.: I have upload a SamPaper 6 to nvg ( this is the last , that I have ) . I > can upload turbo PD disks . I have Enceladus , Public and Arcadia , but I don't > know is this PD or not ? > Any suggestions on where to put these? -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 11:31:58 1995 Message-Id: <199510241125.MAA21783@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 11:24:37 +0000 (GMT) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <9510241028.AA15535@asmal.edh-net> from "Frode Tenneboe" at Oct 24, 95 11:28:35 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 447 Lines: 15 > > > P.S.: I have upload a SamPaper 6 to nvg ( this is the last , that I have ) . I > > can upload turbo PD disks . I have Enceladus , Public and Arcadia , but I don't > > know is this PD or not ? > > > > Any suggestions on where to put these? > > -Frode Well, Public is PD (better bloody had be... Sam Buchanan copied so much stuff from other people, it's a crime to call it a magazine in its own right). Arcadia is now PD too... Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 12:07:53 1995 Message-Id: <9510241158.AA27897@dxmint.cern.ch> From: Allan Skillman (Dr Kid) Subject: Re: Driver Mines... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 24 Oct 95 12:58:56 MET In-Reply-To: <199510241107.MAA21466@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no>; from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 24, 95 11:06 am Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 273 Lines: 12 > > Erm... the file's up there, but it has a length of zero bytes... > Yeah I know - I tried to upload it to the incoming directory and got a "no space left on device" message plus a zero length file I can't delete :( I'll try and get Frode to sort this out Allan -- From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 16:50:47 1995 Message-Id: From: Andrew M Gale Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 16:24:34 +0000 (GMT) In-Reply-To: <9510241015.AA17285@namu23.gwdg.de> from "slawek@namu01.gwdg.de" at Oct 24, 95 11:15:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 281 Lines: 9 > > P.S.: I have upload a SamPaper 6 to nvg ( this is the last , that I have ) . I > can upload turbo PD disks . I have Enceladus , Public and Arcadia , but I don't > know is this PD or not ? Enceladus is certainly not PD, and is, I believe, available from Fredsoft. -Andrew From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 17:53:09 1995 From: tsp93ma@soton.ac.uk Message-Id: <199510241751.RAA03797@b25c-05.sucs.soton.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 17:51:48 +0000 (GMT) In-Reply-To: from "Andrew M Gale" at Oct 24, 95 04:24:34 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 136 Lines: 8 To quote Andrew M Gale: @/ Enceladus is certainly not PD, and is, I believe, available from Fredsoft. @/ -Andrew FredSoft? :-) ....@/ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 20:29:29 1995 From: Mr Andrew M Gale Message-Id: <9510242028.AA06692@central.surrey.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 24 Oct 95 20:28:23 GMT In-Reply-To: <199510241751.RAA03797@b25c-05.sucs.soton.ac.uk>; from "tsp93ma@soton.ac.uk" at Oct 24, 95 5:51 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 207 Lines: 10 > > To quote Andrew M Gale: > @/ Enceladus is certainly not PD, and is, I believe, available from Fredsoft. > @/ -Andrew > > FredSoft? > :-) Is that not what it's called? You know... that Scottish chap. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 24 21:56:02 1995 Message-Id: <199510242151.VAA17947@willow.soton.ac.uk> Subject: Re: FredSoft To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 21:51:27 +0000 (GMT) From: "T.S.Paveley" In-Reply-To: <9510242028.AA06692@central.surrey.ac.uk> from "Mr Andrew M Gale" at Oct 24, 95 08:28:23 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 163 Lines: 9 To quote Mr Andrew M Gale: @/ > FredSoft? @/ Is that not what it's called? You know... that Scottish chap. Fred Publishing. But FredSoft sounds Cool :-) ....@/ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 25 11:30:45 1995 Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 10:47:44 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11339@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: FredSoft X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 367 Lines: 19 In message <199510242151.VAA17947@willow.soton.ac.uk> "T.S.Paveley" writes: > To quote Mr Andrew M Gale: > @/ > FredSoft? > @/ Is that not what it's called? You know... that Scottish chap. > > Fred Publishing. > > But FredSoft sounds Cool :-) > and better than softFred? Colin, WHO exactly WAS Fred? Drestoff? > ....@/ > Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 25 15:56:11 1995 From: insc4cgm@river.tay.ac.uk Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 15:41:45 +0100 Message-Id: <95102515414547@river.tay.ac.uk> To: SAM-USERS@nvg.unit.no Subject: FredSoft X-Vms-To: SAM-USERS@NVG.UNIT.NO Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 725 Lines: 17 Oh Dear - the old Fred question!! Erm..sadly, there is no proper answer. Although I'd be delighted to reveal that it was because I was in love with a girl called Fredericka, or something. However, the truth is that when I got my SAM, there was no software at all so I resorted to creating a disc magazine, because I had been involved in several Spectrum tape magazines. When the first issue looked like i was actually going to try and do something with it (although looking back now, got knows how I ever did!), I was stumped for a name. Not being the imaginative type, I thought the name fred was so common it might just work - like as in fred, sam's mate. Sad story, but hey - you did ask! Colin (the Scottish chap) From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 25 15:58:54 1995 Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 15:19:57 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510251419.AA06331@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Driver Mines... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Original-Sender: owner-sam-users@no.unit.nvg Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 421 Lines: 19 > > Erm... the file's up there, but it has a length of zero bytes... > > > Yeah I know - I tried to upload it to the incoming directory and got a "no > space left on device" message plus a zero length file I can't delete :( > > I'll try and get Frode to sort this out Done! I have also moved sampap* to ./magazines/sam_paper. Any objections? I'll try to get to the other stuff asap. -Frode > > > Allan > > -- > From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 25 16:27:08 1995 From: Diggory Gray Organization: The University of Birmingham To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 16:16:27 GMT Subject: Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Message-Id: <307E3469F@novell3.bham.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 14 Lines: 1 WHO SAM-USERS From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Wed Oct 25 16:45:27 1995 Message-Id: <199510251628.QAA14037@figaro.york.ac.uk> From: gaw2@mailer.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless) Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 16:28:00 +0000 In-Reply-To: insc4cgm -- "FredSoft" (Oct 25, 3:41pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT)) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: FredSoft Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 255 Lines: 8 On Oct 25, 3:41pm in "FredSoft", warbled: ] I was stumped for a name. Not being the imaginative type, I thought the name ] fred was so common it might just work - like as in fred, sam's mate. Kind-of `if you see fred, will you tell him?'... :) Geoff From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 26 08:02:24 1995 From: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Message-Id: <9510260801.AA03109@namu23.gwdg.de> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Cc: slawek@namu01.gwdg.de Subject: Comm'ix bugs Date: Thu, 26 Oct 95 09:01:43 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 638 Lines: 18 Hi !! I find last night a bug in my program and I make it all right . Procedure for clearing screen from cursor -> down ( ESC[J ) has one DEC A to much . Now work all fine and I hope , that was this bug , that You find Simon ... I upload a new version ( I think a last time ... ) to nvg... Frode , You can delete all other versions ... I hope that was all bugs in my program ..... I will today upload to nvg... following disks : Public 5 , Arcadia 5 and Metempsychosis 7 . I have only these , when anyone have other numbers of these diskmagazines , please upload it to nvg too ... Slawek. P.S.: I hope that these disks are PD ... From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 26 10:52:21 1995 Message-Id: X-Sender: scooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 26 Oct 1995 11:26:47 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no From: simon.cooke@umist.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) Subject: Based On An Idea... Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 745 Lines: 21 Hi everyone... I'm toying with the idea of publishing a digest version of the SAM Users Mailing List chat with a suitable threaded reader program on the Based On An Idea disk... Anybody have any comments? Would you prefer this not to happen? Also, it'd be quite cool - Colin MacD, you could perhaps also publish it in FRED... it should be PD anyway :) Just thought it might be a nice idea! Simon -!- Mains Hum: A sine of the times??? +- Email:Simon.Cooke@umist.ac.uk ---- Fidonet: 2:250/124.2 (Simon Cooke) -+ | Snail:1 Dovey Close, Astley, Tyldesley, Manchester, M29 7NP, UK | | Tel: (01942) 886084 Fax: (01942) 886084 (ring voice first to confirm!)| +- WWW: http://jumper.mcc.ac.uk/~simonc ----------------------------------+ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Thu Oct 26 12:21:59 1995 Date: Thu, 26 Oct 1995 12:03:15 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510261103.AA06951@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Based On An Idea... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 0 Lines: 20 From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 07:17:38 1995 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 06:16:08 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11368@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Based On An Idea... X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 357 Lines: 11 Hmm, who would this disc go to? I have seen some dodgy language here in the past and thus you would beed to edit anything like that. Also, there could be an increase in advertising here if it was a straight dump of here. What about comments that might be rather indiscrete about certain persons? I have seen those here! :-) Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 08:01:07 1995 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 08:25:09 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510270725.AA07933@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Based On An Idea... X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 408 Lines: 13 > Hmm, who would this disc go to? I have seen some dodgy language > here in the past and thus you would beed to edit anything like > that. Also, there could be an increase in advertising here if it > was a straight dump of here. What about comments that might be > rather indiscrete about certain persons? I have seen those here! > :-) Dodgy language? Indiscrete? What do you mean? ;-) > > Brian -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 10:40:53 1995 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 10:10:27 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11382@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Based On An Idea... X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 131 Lines: 7 I think it means my spelling/typing is not getting any better when its early and I am in a hurry! Brian -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 11:38:01 1995 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 11:36:05 +0100 (BST) From: Daniel James Doore X-Sender: iq4d4385@jaffle-fddi To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Based On An Idea... In-Reply-To: <11368@bgserv.demon.co.uk> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 595 Lines: 22 On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Brian Gaff Sam Dept. wrote: > Hmm, who would this disc go to? I have seen some dodgy language > here in the past and thus you would beed to edit anything like > that. Also, there could be an increase in advertising here if it > was a straight dump of here. What about comments that might be > rather indiscrete about certain persons? I have seen those here! > :-) Dodgy language?? Bollocks. :) Dan. +---------------------------------------+ | Dan Doore - Ex-Head Pod And Dogsbody | | D.J.Doore-iq4d4385@lmu.ac.uk | +---------------------------------------+ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 12:16:42 1995 Message-Id: <199510271215.NAA28406@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Based On An Idea... To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 12:14:52 +0000 (GMT) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <11368@bgserv.demon.co.uk> from "Brian Gaff Sam Dept." at Oct 27, 95 06:16:08 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1414 Lines: 32 > > Hmm, who would this disc go to? I have seen some dodgy language > here in the past and thus you would beed to edit anything like > that. Also, there could be an increase in advertising here if it > was a straight dump of here. What about comments that might be > rather indiscrete about certain persons? I have seen those here! > :-) Well, the disc would go out to subscribers / buyers of Based On An Idea..., but also the SAM Users section would be PD, so it could be spread by other PD discs, or even on Fred. And yep, it would need careful editing. What if we say that large adverts won't make it through to the disk, and that there will be a censorship option in the browser (hidden a few levels deep in the options) so that it defaults to "no bad language", and asterisks it out... As for personal opinion... Hmmm... I'd like to see what other people think about that side of it. It might be interesting to keep them in - nothing like keeping a debate lively for people to read - but then, it might be a little too inflammatory and derogatory for some... I'm not sure... But we'd have to cut down a certain amount of the crap.. and we've got nearly 2 years of material now to start serialising.. I reckon SAM users who aren't on the net might be interested to see how things are worked on, how sam users work together, more of a feeling for the people whose stuff they've seen... etc etc :) Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 12:18:28 1995 From: William Eric Easson <9264201E@STUDENT.GLA.AC.UK> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 12:09:32 BST Subject: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show X-Confirm-Reading-To: "William Eric Easson" <9264201E@STUDENT.GLA.AC.UK> X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Message-Id: <340CA45166@student.gla.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 495 Lines: 24 > Dodgy language?? > > Bollocks. > > :) > Yeah. Just a load of absolute sh*te. What the ***k was he talking about anyway? I don't b***dy swear all that ***k**g much anyway. >;-> Need to swear to let off steam. We don't have Terminal Velocity or Descent on the SAM. Yet. Anyone going to the Scottish Sam and Speccy show on Nov 12th in Edinburgh? Will Easson, 4th Year student at the Glasgow vet School 9264201e@student.gla.ac.uk http://www.src.gla.ac.uk/users/club02/GUVZS/ "Why me?" From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 12:56:38 1995 Message-Id: <199510271255.NAA28949@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 12:55:26 +0000 (GMT) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) In-Reply-To: <340CA45166@student.gla.ac.uk> from "William Eric Easson" at Oct 27, 95 12:09:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 303 Lines: 12 > Need to swear to let off steam. We don't have Terminal Velocity or > Descent on the SAM. Yet. *grins* YET... > Anyone going to the Scottish Sam and Speccy show on Nov 12th in > Edinburgh? Erm... I *may* be if I can get there... dunno (finances are a bit on the low side at the moment)... Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 13:12:30 1995 From: Diggory Gray Organization: The University of Birmingham To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:00:01 GMT Subject: RCPT: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.22 Message-Id: <1AE0E738AD@novell3.bham.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 229 Lines: 9 Confirmation of reading: your message - Date: 27 Oct 95 12:09 To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show Was read at 12:59, 27 Oct 95. Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 13:13:05 1995 From: William Eric Easson <9264201E@STUDENT.GLA.AC.UK> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:00:05 BST Subject: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show X-Confirm-Reading-To: "William Eric Easson" <9264201E@STUDENT.GLA.AC.UK> X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Message-Id: <34E4A7088C@student.gla.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 783 Lines: 26 > > Need to swear to let off steam. We don't have Terminal Velocity or > > Descent on the SAM. Yet. > > *grins* YET... > > > Anyone going to the Scottish Sam and Speccy show on Nov 12th in > > Edinburgh? > > Erm... I *may* be if I can get there... dunno (finances are a bit on the low > side at the moment)... > Know what you mean. I have the annual vet students' sports weekend the weekend afterwards. It's in Bristol, and costs stlg60. The show is (almost) up the road. Takes about an hour to get there from Glasgow. I can never make it to "Honest" Bob Brenchley's do in Gloucester, so I hope there will be a bit of a turn-out. I'd like to get my mitts on a DAC or Quazar, but I'd want to hear them for myself before parting with that much cash..! -Will Easson From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 13:23:04 1995 Message-Id: <199510271321.OAA29433@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> Subject: Scottish Speccy Show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:21:43 +0000 (GMT) Cc: Simon.Cooke@nessie.mcc.ac.uk (Simon Cooke) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Simon Cooke Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 296 Lines: 8 WRT: the Scottish Speccy show (and because I've lost Colin Piggot's email address - sorry Colin) If I can make it there, I've got some nice speakers (bought a PC sound card recently so I needed them) that you could use on the Quazar this time... 7W, but it's quite good quality output... Simon From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 13:43:02 1995 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:41:57 +0000 (GMT) From: Tim Wells <93tgw@eng.cam.ac.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Scottish Show Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 99 Lines: 7 Can anyone send me details of this Scottish show? Like where, when and how much? Thanks, Tim W. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 14:45:00 1995 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 14:25:25 GMT From: Briansam@bgserv.demon.co.uk (Brian Gaff Sam Dept.) Message-Id: <11397@bgserv.demon.co.uk> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Based On An Idea... X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 807 Lines: 28 In message Daniel James Doore writes: > On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Brian Gaff Sam Dept. wrote: > > > Hmm, who would this disc go to? I have seen some dodgy language > > here in the past and thus you would beed to edit anything like > > that. Also, there could be an increase in advertising here if it > > was a straight dump of here. What about comments that might be > > rather indiscrete about certain persons? I have seen those here! > > :-) > > Dodgy language?? > > Bollocks. > What is this pheasant plucker doing here? :-) > :) > > Dan. > > +---------------------------------------+ > | Dan Doore - Ex-Head Pod And Dogsbody | > | D.J.Doore-iq4d4385@lmu.ac.uk | > +---------------------------------------+ > > -- Brian Gaff Sam Dept. From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 15:07:25 1995 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 15:52:04 +0100 From: ft@asmal (Frode Tenneboe) Message-Id: <9510271452.AA08381@asmal.edh-net> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: RCPT: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 290 Lines: 14 > Confirmation of reading: your message - > > Date: 27 Oct 95 13:00 > To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no > Subject: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show > > Was read at 13:18, 27 Oct 95. > > Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) > Would you please cut that!!!! -Frode From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 17:52:58 1995 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:47:10 +0000 (GMT) From: Steve Taylor X-Sender: sct1000@blue.csi.cam.ac.uk To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: RCPT: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show In-Reply-To: <1B3C1A10D7@novell3.bham.ac.uk> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 652 Lines: 22 On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Diggory Gray wrote: > Confirmation of reading: your message - > > Date: 27 Oct 95 13:00 > To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no > Subject: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show > > Was read at 13:18, 27 Oct 95. > > Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) > Aaarghh! Bloody Pegusus users! +--------------------------------------------------------------+ | Steve Taylor sct1000@cam.ac.uk | | Pembroke College http://nikita.pem.cam.ac.uk/sct1000/ | | Cambridge CB2 1RF | +--------------------------------------------------------------+ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Oct 27 19:47:01 1995 From: "Will Easson (" LongBow ")" <9264201E@STUDENT.GLA.AC.UK> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 19:42:31 BST Subject: Re: RCPT: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Message-Id: <3B9A0E2B18@student.gla.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1172 Lines: 36 > Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:47:10 +0000 (GMT) > From: Steve Taylor > To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no > Subject: Re: RCPT: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show > Reply-to: sam-users@nvg.unit.no > On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Diggory Gray wrote: > > > Confirmation of reading: your message - > > > > Date: 27 Oct 95 13:00 > > To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no > > Subject: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show > > > > Was read at 13:18, 27 Oct 95. > > > > Diggory Gray ( DJG528@bham.ac.uk ) > > > > Aaarghh! Bloody Pegusus users! > > +--------------------------------------------------------------+ > | Steve Taylor sct1000@cam.ac.uk | > | Pembroke College http://nikita.pem.cam.ac.uk/sct1000/ | > | Cambridge CB2 1RF | > +--------------------------------------------------------------+ Sorry. I'll try to remember to switch that off when I post to the group! -Will Will Easson, 4th Year student at the Glasgow vet School 9264201e@student.gla.ac.uk http://www.src.gla.ac.uk/users/club02/GUVZS/ "Why me?" From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Sun Oct 29 10:13:27 1995 Date: Sat, 28 Oct 95 16:31:16 PDT From: Stefan Drissen Subject: Re: Based On An Idea & Scottish Speccy show To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no X-Mailer: Chameleon - TCP/IP for Windows by NetManage, Inc. Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 746 Lines: 27 >The show is (almost) up the road. Takes about an hour to get there >from Glasgow. I can never make it to "Honest" Bob Brenchley's do in >Gloucester, so I hope there will be a bit of a turn-out. > >I'd like to get my mitts on a DAC or Quazar, but I'd want to hear >them for myself before parting with that much cash..! Derek Morgan should be selling the SAMdacs for Ben. I'm not sure if he will be there though. Else maybe Colin Macdonald can take his SAMdac to the show so that you can hear it. (only 25 pounds). Was that advert small enough for BOAI? > >-Will Easson Stefan Drissen aka Solar Flare of Entropy E-mail: drissen@pi.net S-mail: Zevende Herven 6, 5232 JZ 's-Hertogenbosch, The Netherlands T-mail: +31-73-414969 From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 31 12:55:34 1995 Message-Id: From: Andrew M Gale Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 12:53:48 +0000 (GMT) In-Reply-To: <199510230942.KAA07620@sabre-wulf.nvg.unit.no> from "Simon Cooke" at Oct 23, 95 09:41:49 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 117 Lines: 5 What's happened to you all? Have you all got lock-jaw, or have I been mysteriously deleted from the list?! -Andrew From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 31 13:23:39 1995 From: "Will Easson (LongBow)" <9264201E@STUDENT.GLA.AC.UK> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 13:17:28 BST Subject: Re: Back on line (was Re: in bed with flu) ;) Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Message-Id: <2C9B5C322F@student.gla.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 174 Lines: 13 > What's happened to you all? Have you all got lock-jaw, > or have I been mysteriously deleted from the list?! > > -Andrew > I'm still here. All lonely. -sniff- -Will From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 31 14:28:24 1995 Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 14:21:18 +0000 (GMT) From: Daniel James Doore X-Sender: iq4d4385@jaffle-fddi To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Subject: Re: Based On An Idea... In-Reply-To: <11397@bgserv.demon.co.uk> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 531 Lines: 23 On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Brian Gaff Sam Dept. wrote: > > Dodgy language?? > > > > Bollocks. > > > What is this pheasant plucker doing here? :-) Nice to see you too Brian :) BTW: I am not very pleasent, dunno about the second bit... So, What's being going down of late on the old sam users forum then? Has the Hard Drive been finished? What's new then? Dan. +---------------------------------------+ | Dan Doore - Ex-Head Pod And Dogsbody | | D.J.Doore-iq4d4385@lmu.ac.uk | +---------------------------------------+ From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Tue Oct 31 16:04:54 1995 From: "Will Easson (LongBow)" <9264201E@STUDENT.GLA.AC.UK> To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 15:42:07 BST Subject: Re: Based On An Idea... Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Message-Id: <2F051A25CB@student.gla.ac.uk> Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no Status: RO Content-Length: 269 Lines: 12 > Has the Hard Drive been finished? What's new then? > I think I may be pregnant. Will Easson, 4th Year student at the Glasgow vet School 9264201e@student.gla.ac.uk http://www.gla.ac.uk/Clubs/WebSoc/~9264201e/ http://www.src.gla.ac.uk/users/club02/GUVZS/ "Why me?"