From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 1 00:04:27 1999 Message-ID: <375314F9.4C8B6496@lineone.net> Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 00:02:17 +0100 From: Gavin Smith Organization: Castle Publishing X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Where's Bob? References: <000d01beab62$2d4824c0$a55008c3@persona> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 370 Lines: 8 Got a call from a SAM Community member the other night, Vic Taylor (he's 82 but sounds about 20!) - he's wondering what's happened to Bob Brenchley. Apparently he's phoned him a few times, but the number seems to have been cut off. Also he has written to him a couple of times trying to buy a reconditioned SAM, but no reply. So, what's up with Bob? Anyone know? Gavin From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 1 08:48:38 1999 Message-ID: <000a01beac02$963f5e80$895008c3@persona> From: "David L" To: Subject: Re: Where's Bob? Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 08:44:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 946 Lines: 31 Oh, if you speak to Vic - can you assure him that Blitz 9 should be out soon. It seems as if the original finished version I sent to Persona HQ for checking about 5-6 weeks ago went walkies (sent it via work email ) so I'm resending by snail-mail today. All the best, David -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Smith To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: 01 June 1999 00:08 Subject: Where's Bob? >Thanks for using NetForward! >http://www.netforward.com >v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v > >Got a call from a SAM Community member the other night, Vic Taylor (he's >82 but sounds about 20!) - he's wondering what's happened to Bob >Brenchley. Apparently he's phoned him a few times, but the number seems >to have been cut off. Also he has written to him a couple of times >trying to buy a reconditioned SAM, but no reply. So, what's up with Bob? >Anyone know? > >Gavin > > From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 1 08:48:38 1999 Message-ID: <001201beac02$a7454780$895008c3@persona> From: "David L" To: Subject: Re: Where's Bob? Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 08:44:59 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 56 Lines: 1 Shit that should have been sent to Gavin - not the list From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 1 10:29:54 1999 Message-ID: <3753A642.37EA8292@earthling.net> Date: Tue, 01 Jun 1999 09:22:10 +0000 From: Andrew Gallagher Organization: QUB X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.0.36 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Getting those encrypted games in a SIM Coupe-able format References: <000201bea9d1$0bcd1040$600b883e@david> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 659 Lines: 24 David Laundon wrote: > > AFAIK the SAM Elite is basically just the same as a SAM Coupe except that : > > A: There is a parallel printer interface built in (don't ask me where > though!) In the white top part of the case, just behind the number keys. It is a BBC-style connector and there is a ribbon cable inside connecting it to an interface which (correct me if I'm wrong) I think plugs into one of the disk drive slots...(?) > > B: They were (are?!) only released as 512K versions. > C: The disk drive(s) were the 'new style' (I think). > > Dave Laundon. -- Andrew Gallagher http://members.tripod.com/~AndrewGallagher/id.html From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 1 10:59:15 1999 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Manual References: X-Face: "J~~0'L`GfL^sW4%+i35x#X308)K/$7\]qy)UZ$`k:}Bx]6mgAA^N5,@brn/19TPn%o;j28 W7mD)UN~se8P9\3?wU.g+i9)X Date: 01 Jun 1999 10:45:44 +0100 In-Reply-To: Stuart Brady's message of "Fri, 28 May 1999 20:12:42 +0100" Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.070084 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.84) Emacs/20.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 1105 Lines: 34 Stuart Brady writes: > Yes, but gecko has to use HTML 4, and other bloated standards. It'd be > better if people just used a new markup language, which works. HTML 4 is > not exactly easy to write with a text editor, as far as I can see. I > took one look at W3C's documentation and gave up. > > All the editors that do exist are awful. Netscape's editor removes

> tags, so if you've got an
between paragraphs, the space before the > line is removed - even on Communicator. Well it's entitled to, as far as HTML 3.2 is concerned

tags are not necessary and shouldn't be used to force breaks like you seem to be using them to, all that happens when you render This paragraph

Next paragraph is that the browser treats it exactly as if you had written This paragraph

Next paragraph Which you should be using to force the space. Do this and if Netscape's editor removes the

I'll be surprised :) Lee. -- I was doing object-oriented assembly at 1 year old ... For some reason my mom insists on calling it "Playing with blocks" From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 1 20:54:04 1999 Message-ID: <001601beac68$664ab1a0$9e5008c3@persona> From: "David L" To: Subject: Re: Where's Bob? Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 20:53:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 723 Lines: 23 Rang 01452 412572 before and it seems okay to me.... -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Smith To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: 01 June 1999 00:08 Subject: Where's Bob? >Thanks for using NetForward! >http://www.netforward.com >v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v > >Got a call from a SAM Community member the other night, Vic Taylor (he's >82 but sounds about 20!) - he's wondering what's happened to Bob >Brenchley. Apparently he's phoned him a few times, but the number seems >to have been cut off. Also he has written to him a couple of times >trying to buy a reconditioned SAM, but no reply. So, what's up with Bob? >Anyone know? > >Gavin > > From imc@comlab.ox.ac.uk Wed Jun 2 10:56:51 1999 Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 10:56:51 +0100 From: Ian Collier To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Manual Message-ID: <19990602105651.E3565@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mail-Followup-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Lee Willis on Tue, Jun 01, 1999 at 10:45:44AM +0100 Status: RO Content-Length: 832 Lines: 22 On Tue, Jun 01, 1999 at 10:45:44AM +0100, Lee Willis wrote: > Well it's entitled to, as far as HTML 3.2 is concerned

tags are not > necessary and shouldn't be used to force breaks Well, no, but it's valid HTML and if it works then what the hey. > This paragraph >

>

>

Next paragraph > Which you should be using to force the space. No. One of the very first style guides I read (probably back at HTML 1) said explicitly "don't write

". You can't guarantee that any particular browser will add a blank line. The
tag implies the end of the paragraph - how can a horizontal line be part of a paragraph? So what you've written there is a paragraph with no text in it - I don't know whether that's valid HTML but if it is then the browser is completely at liberty to ignore the empty paragraph. imc From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 2 11:35:38 1999 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Manual References: <19990602105651.E3565@comlab.ox.ac.uk> X-Face: "J~~0'L`GfL^sW4%+i35x#X308)K/$7\]qy)UZ$`k:}Bx]6mgAA^N5,@brn/19TPn%o;j28 W7mD)UN~se8P9\3?wU.g+i9)X Date: 02 Jun 1999 11:32:22 +0100 Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.070084 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.84) Emacs/20.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 1740 Lines: 53 Ian Collier writes: > On Tue, Jun 01, 1999 at 10:45:44AM +0100, Lee Willis wrote: > > Well it's entitled to, as far as HTML 3.2 is concerned

tags are not > > necessary and shouldn't be used to force breaks > > Well, no, but it's valid HTML and if it works then what the hey. Yes but the question is *why* it works, ie because the browser converts it to what I said > >

> >

> >

Next paragraph The reason he was getting a break when he had the

was because his browser was in effect treating it as an

. The

on its own doesn't give a break and so when he loses the

(And therefore the implied

) he gets no break because the

is treated as part of the paragraph (Wrongly I agree, but that's what happens!) > > Which you should be using to force the space. Hmm, yeah OK s/\./ in most common browsers./ :) > The
tag implies the end of the paragraph - how can a horizontal > line be part of a paragraph? Good point, I hadn't actually thought about it too much :( > So what you've written there is a paragraph with no text in it No, it's a paragraph containing a single space, which hence requires proper spacing as if it were a paragraph containing some "visible" text.

*is* an empty paragraph and could be folded out > don't know whether that's valid HTML It is. > completely at liberty to ignore the empty paragraph. Well if it was an entirely empty paragraph then yes it is, but it isn't it contains a space (Well actually a new line, but that is in essence 'whitespace') and thus is not empty per se. Lee. -- I was doing object-oriented assembly at 1 year old ... For some reason my mom insists on calling it "Playing with blocks" From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 2 11:45:01 1999 Message-ID: <0AEF0EB21F09D211AE4E0080C82733BF851AD5@mailhost.aculab.com> From: Justin Skists To: "'sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no'" Subject: RE: Manual Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 11:49:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 648 Lines: 23 >The reason he was getting a break when he had the

was because his I didn't think

existed... >> completely at liberty to ignore the empty paragraph. > >Well if it was an entirely empty paragraph then yes it is, but it isn't >it contains a space (Well actually a new line, but that is in essence >'whitespace') and thus is not empty per se. My experience seems to suggest that unless you use certain tags, such as 
 and
, the browser is at liberty to ignore whitespace as appropriate. eg: this would all end up on one line

Actually, I'm lost as to what the desired effect is supposed to be in this discussion.... Jut. From imc@comlab.ox.ac.uk Wed Jun 2 11:47:09 1999 Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 11:47:09 +0100 From: Ian Collier To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Manual Message-ID: <19990602114709.G3565@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mail-Followup-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no References: <19990602105651.E3565@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Lee Willis on Wed, Jun 02, 1999 at 11:32:22AM +0100 Status: RO Content-Length: 694 Lines: 28 On Wed, Jun 02, 1999 at 11:32:22AM +0100, Lee Willis wrote: > > So what you've written there is a paragraph with no text in it > No, it's a paragraph containing a single space, which hence requires > proper spacing as if it were a paragraph containing some "visible" text. I think not. Try this:

Hello

World.

Do you see enough space for three blank paragraphs in there? I don't. Whitespace doesn't count at the start of a paragraph; otherwise,

and

hello hello would look different. That's why certain broken HTML generators insert

 

to make blank lines. That really is a paragraph with a space in it. imc From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 2 12:49:49 1999 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Manual References: <0AEF0EB21F09D211AE4E0080C82733BF851AD5@mailhost.aculab.com> X-Face: "J~~0'L`GfL^sW4%+i35x#X308)K/$7\]qy)UZ$`k:}Bx]6mgAA^N5,@brn/19TPn%o;j28 W7mD)UN~se8P9\3?wU.g+i9)X Date: 02 Jun 1999 12:36:18 +0100 Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.070084 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.84) Emacs/20.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 590 Lines: 18 Justin Skists writes: > I didn't think

existed... Yep, it's just not necessary, it's implied by things like

,

etc. etc. > My experience seems to suggest that unless you use certain tags, such > as 
 and
, the browser is at liberty to ignore whitespace as > appropriate. eg: Not ignore as such ... basically any sequence of whitespace (space, newline, or tab characters) is flattened to a single space. Lee. -- I was doing object-oriented assembly at 1 year old ... For some reason my mom insists on calling it "Playing with blocks" From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 2 12:49:50 1999 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Manual References: <19990602105651.E3565@comlab.ox.ac.uk> <19990602114709.G3565@comlab.ox.ac.uk> X-Face: "J~~0'L`GfL^sW4%+i35x#X308)K/$7\]qy)UZ$`k:}Bx]6mgAA^N5,@brn/19TPn%o;j28 W7mD)UN~se8P9\3?wU.g+i9)X Date: 02 Jun 1999 12:42:39 +0100 Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.070084 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.84) Emacs/20.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1527 Lines: 40 Ian Collier writes: > On Wed, Jun 02, 1999 at 11:32:22AM +0100, Lee Willis wrote: > > > So what you've written there is a paragraph with no text in it > > > No, it's a paragraph containing a single space, which hence requires > > proper spacing as if it were a paragraph containing some "visible" text. > > I think not. Try this: [Snipped] > Do you see enough space for three blank paragraphs in there? I don't. > Whitespace doesn't count at the start of a paragraph; otherwise, No because all the whitespace caused by the three paragraphs is folded into a single one ... >

and

hello > hello Whitespace caused by a paragraph tag

is the same conceptually as whitespace caused by spaces, tabs or newlines, hence the space immediately following a paragraph is folded away into /dev/null as it were. > would look different. That's why certain broken HTML generators insert >

 

to make blank lines. That really is a paragraph with a > space in it. ^^ non-breaking I don't think I explained my last email very well so it may seem at odds. I've worried about this sort of thing a lot in the past (My final year project at Uni was a web-browser!) so I know in my head how it all works but exaplaining it ain't too easy especially when I'm rushing 'coz I'm at work and I have six-zillion other things to worry about!) Lee. -- I was doing object-oriented assembly at 1 year old ... For some reason my mom insists on calling it "Playing with blocks" From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 3 13:34:23 1999 Message-Id: <005001beadba$5fd94770$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: <374FEF6C.EC09B061@btinternet.com> Subject: Re: A simple Mode-X question Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 14:12:39 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by mail.comlab.ox.ac.uk id NAA18543 Status: RO Content-Length: 1424 Lines: 43 Mode-X on Sam? I haven't heard this. On PC, Mode-X shouldn't be used anymore, since 1.) it is extremely slow 2.) it is low resolution only 3.) you can't use accelerators 4.) Windows doesn't support all x-modes 5.) As you showed, it is extremely complicated to use mode-x. SVGA is faster in hires than mode-x in lowres!!! ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Thomas Harte To: SAM Mailing List Sent: 29. května 1999 15:45 Subject: A simple Mode-X question > Hi, > > I've never been too sure about the memory layout of Mode-X and so on, > so I am asking one simple question, would it be faster to : > > a) blit 144 32x27 tiles to a Mode-X screen arranged so as to form a > rectangle of 384x324, or > > b) blit the same tiles to a memory bitmap, then to the mode-x screen > as a single rectangle of 384x324? > > And if the answer is a), which would be the fastest blitting order (you > know, as in left to right, top to bottom or every odd, then every even > or whatever) to minimise bank switching / whatever else takes up time in > drawing to mode-x screens? > > -Thomas > From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 3 13:41:12 1999 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: A simple Mode-X question References: <374FEF6C.EC09B061@btinternet.com> <005001beadba$5fd94770$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> X-Face: "J~~0'L`GfL^sW4%+i35x#X308)K/$7\]qy)UZ$`k:}Bx]6mgAA^N5,@brn/19TPn%o;j28 W7mD)UN~se8P9\3?wU.g+i9)X Date: 03 Jun 1999 13:39:18 +0100 In-Reply-To: "Aley Keprt"'s message of "Thu, 3 Jun 1999 14:12:39 +0200" Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.070084 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.84) Emacs/20.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 521 Lines: 15 "Aley Keprt" writes: > Mode-X on Sam? I haven't heard this. I think he means Mode X where X is a value between 1 and 4 :) The question therefore being, what's the quickest way of drawing in each of SAM's MODES, which I'm not overly qualified to answer right now what with my SAM having been stuffed in various "out-of-the-way" places for a year or two now :( Lee. -- I was doing object-oriented assembly at 1 year old ... For some reason my mom insists on calling it "Playing with blocks" From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 3 13:48:30 1999 Message-Id: <013201beadbc$b73c93d0$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: <374FCE8B.1168F55C@btinternet.com> Subject: Re: The win32 SIM Coupe Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 14:29:25 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by mail.comlab.ox.ac.uk id NAA18900 Status: RO Content-Length: 1037 Lines: 29 Since it is noncommercial product, people doing Win32 version probably won't have sufficient resources (time, ability, ...) to do anything with Linux. Sorry. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Thomas Harte To: SAM Mailing List Sent: 29. května 1999 13:24 Subject: The win32 SIM Coupe > Hi, > > I know it isn't out or anything, I'm not about to ask something stupid > like 'where can I get it', I'm just aware from experience that writing > for windows can be an entirely different process to writing for DOS, and > therefore creating a windows version will most probably have meant a > large change in code. So . . . the question . . . has Linux support been > dropped? > > -Thomas > From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 3 13:56:56 1999 Message-Id: <014901beadbd$bd5808c0$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: <19990530182254.66818.qmail@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: Z80 Assembler update Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 14:36:44 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by mail.comlab.ox.ac.uk id NAA19106 Status: RO Content-Length: 2346 Lines: 56 I don't understand whether this Z80 will be for Sam or PC. It looks like Java app., this would be much better. Does it support clever macros? ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Simon Cooke To: Sent: 30. května 1999 20:22 Subject: Z80 Assembler update > Well folks, it's slow going but the z80 assembler is getting there inch by > inch. Just thought I'd let you know that I have an added incentive to get it > finished; it's probably going to be one of the sample apps for Visual Studio > 7 :) [probably, that is... we don't know for sure yet. I do know that it's > part of our build process internally to make sure that we're not breaking > existing functionality when we throw new code into the mix] > > Assembler: lexer's done, parser is partially complete, output stage is > partially complete. It quite happily throws descriptive errors (missing > bracket, need a number here, can't have that register pair in this > instruction, operation may overwrite existing code, that kind of thing). > There are also multiple warning levels so you can pick and choose how > bad-ass you want to be with your code. It'll even warn you if the values > you're setting are too large to fit into a register... > > :) > > IDE: Color coded editor is going through a rewrite to make it more > functional, and to add scripting/automation capabilities. If you've got a > file open in the editor, it'll assemble straight from there to reduce time > (and as it'll already have gone through one stage of parsing & lexing to do > the color coding, it'll assemble MUCH faster). Docking window support is > coming along nicely. The initial version will be written for the Microsoft > JVM, and then it'll be ported to other languages when the code has > stabilized. (Probably VC++). I'll also work on breaking the assembler out > into its own DLL. > > So there ya have it. > > Si > > > _______________________________________________________________ > Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 3 14:19:33 1999 X-Sender: asc25@pop.hermes.cam.ac.uk Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: "Aley Keprt"'s message of "Thu, 3 Jun 1999 14:12:39 +0200" <374FEF6C.EC09B061@btinternet.com> <005001beadba$5fd94770$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 13:54:06 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: Re: A simple Mode-X question X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 650 Lines: 20 At 1:39 pm +0100 3/6/99, Lee Willis wrote: >"Aley Keprt" writes: > >> Mode-X on Sam? I haven't heard this. > >I think he means Mode X where X is a value between 1 and 4 :) No, I think he just posted to the wrong list. Partly because he was talking about 384x324 rectangles, but mostly because (in message <37514825.35093A41@btinternet.com>) he said so. Andrew -- | Andrew Collier | email asc25@cam.ac.uk | Talk sense to a | Part 2 NatSci | http://carou.sel.cam.ac.uk/ | fool and he +----------------+----------------ICQ:38645805-+ calls you foolish | Selwyn College Student Computer Support Team | -- Euripides From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 3 14:34:29 1999 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: A simple Mode-X question References: <374FEF6C.EC09B061@btinternet.com> <005001beadba$5fd94770$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> X-Face: "J~~0'L`GfL^sW4%+i35x#X308)K/$7\]qy)UZ$`k:}Bx]6mgAA^N5,@brn/19TPn%o;j28 W7mD)UN~se8P9\3?wU.g+i9)X Date: 03 Jun 1999 14:31:43 +0100 In-Reply-To: Andrew Collier's message of "Thu, 3 Jun 1999 13:54:06 +0100" Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.070084 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.84) Emacs/20.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 510 Lines: 19 Andrew Collier writes: > No, I think he just posted to the wrong list. > > Partly because he was talking about 384x324 rectangles, but mostly because > (in message <37514825.35093A41@btinternet.com>) he said so. Oops, that'll teach me to a) Only read bits of messages (I saw the 384 and assumed MODE 3) b) Only read some messages. Oops, sorry folks :( Lee. -- I was doing object-oriented assembly at 1 year old ... For some reason my mom insists on calling it "Playing with blocks" From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 3 15:12:10 1999 From: "Si Owen" To: Subject: RE: Z80 Assembler update Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 15:03:47 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 In-Reply-To: <014901beadbd$bd5808c0$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> Importance: Normal X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 293 Lines: 12 > I don't understand whether this Z80 will be for Sam or PC. > It looks like Java app., this would be much better. It's for the PC, but it'll make it much easier to develop code for the SAM :-) > Does it support clever macros? Knowing Simon, it'll support everything you'll ever need! Si From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 3 15:43:24 1999 From: "Si Owen" To: Subject: RE: The win32 SIM Coupe Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 15:13:12 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 In-Reply-To: <013201beadbc$b73c93d0$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> Importance: Normal X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 566 Lines: 14 Alex Keprt wrote: > Since it is noncommercial product, people doing Win32 version > probably won't have sufficient resources (time, ability, ...) to > do anything with Linux. I've not had time to touch the Win32 version in about 5 weeks, and am tied up for another few weeks yet :-/ I hope to get stuck into it after that and finally get a version ready to people to use. Time is the main problem will most things, as most of us have full time jobs! There's certainly plenty of ability around to get a Linux version done, it's just the time problem again... Si From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 3 17:48:31 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: wabe.dcs.warwick.ac.uk: csuan owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 17:39:08 +0100 (BST) From: Paul Walker To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The win32 SIM Coupe In-Reply-To: <013201beadbc$b73c93d0$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 466 Lines: 13 On Thu, 3 Jun 1999, Aley Keprt wrote: > Since it is noncommercial product, people doing Win32 version > probably won't have sufficient resources (time, ability, ...) to do anything > with Linux. Sorry. Yeah, but as soon as the source code comes out (or even before, if a CVS server is used) any changes/improvements can be ported back to Linux. most of the code should be the same between versions anyway, it'll just be the drawing/sound/etc which changes. Paul From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 4 17:47:49 1999 Message-ID: <003201beaea9$a5031020$64b259c3@l2u4e5> From: "Peter Harkess" To: Subject: Anybody Know Dave W`s mail addr Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 17:45:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.unit.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 182 Lines: 9 As it say`s does anybody know Dave Whitmore`s e-mail address as i`ve just wiped all my mail and forgot to take note of e-mail addresses. DOH!! cheers Peter Harkess From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 4 18:18:37 1999 Message-ID: <37580A28.273FB6C@bonbon.net> Date: Fri, 04 Jun 1999 18:17:28 +0100 From: Martin Fitzpatrick X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en,en-US MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Anybody Know Dave W`s mail addr References: <003201beaea9$a5031020$64b259c3@l2u4e5> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 392 Lines: 25 hullo..... its.... davegw@clara.co.uk ...though he probably got your message on the list!! Martin Peter Harkess wrote: > > As it say`s does anybody know Dave Whitmore`s e-mail address as i`ve just > wiped all my mail and forgot to take note of e-mail addresses. > > DOH!! > > cheers > Peter Harkess > -- Email: poohsticks@bonbon.net ICQ#: 11077801 AOL/CServeIM: Flupert From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 4 21:50:28 1999 From: davgw@clara.co.uk (Dave Whitmore) To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Anybody Know Dave W`s mail addr Date: Fri, 04 Jun 1999 20:47:23 GMT Message-ID: <37583900.2315252@relay.clara.net> References: <003201beaea9$a5031020$64b259c3@l2u4e5> <37580A28.273FB6C@bonbon.net> In-Reply-To: <37580A28.273FB6C@bonbon.net> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 649 Lines: 27 On Fri, 04 Jun 1999 18:17:28 +0100 Fri, 4 Jun 99 21:35:48 BST, Martin Fitzpatrick wrote: >hullo.... Hallieow >its.... > >davegw@clara.co.uk ^ I'm afraid it isn't. :) >...though he probably got your message on the list!! That's true though. davgw@clara.co.uk for now, but I might go to one of the free ones. It seems daft throwing 11 quid a month away these days. Then again, I've heard that there are trials running ATM by an ISP in Brum where you pay a flat tenner a month and you can dial up free and stay on (downloading MP3s and naughty pictures) for as long as you like. Sounds good to me! :-) Bye Dave From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 4 23:54:28 1999 Message-ID: <375858A6.BA43865D@bonbon.net> Date: Fri, 04 Jun 1999 23:52:22 +0100 From: Martin Fitzpatrick X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en,en-US MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Anybody Know Dave W`s mail addr References: <003201beaea9$a5031020$64b259c3@l2u4e5> <37580A28.273FB6C@bonbon.net> <37583900.2315252@relay.clara.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1821 Lines: 52 Dave Whitmore wrote: > > On Fri, 04 Jun 1999 18:17:28 +0100 Fri, 4 Jun 99 21:35:48 BST, Martin > Fitzpatrick wrote: > > >its.... > > > >davegw@clara.co.uk > ^ > I'm afraid it isn't. :) > > >...though he probably got your message on the list!! > > That's true though. > > davgw@clara.co.uk for now, but I might go to one of the free ones. It You just said it wasn't!... Liar liar, pants on fire... Oh.. its spelt differently... Is it davgw then or davegw? Who spelt it wrong, me or you? > seems daft throwing 11 quid a month away these days. Then again, I've > heard that there are trials running ATM by an ISP in Brum where you > pay a flat tenner a month and you can dial up free and stay on > (downloading MP3s and naughty pictures) for as long as you like. > Sounds good to me! :-) Yeh..... well, it might be an idea to get one of those free-email things anyway... I had one (pmail.net) which was a bit rubbish - and died for a week... Just long enough for me to find HOTPOP ....which has all sorts of great email hostnames... like punkass & phreaker & bonbon .... hmm.... Well, you can set them to redirect... how about davegw@punkass.net ...its got a certain ring to it... Nobody'll dare mess with you then :o) I found a free connection one ...one (dunno what its called) that offered free access - as long as you had their adverts plastered over the top of your screen (annoying).. and one that said it was free bar email adverts.... www.free-call.net i think... though I signed up and heard nothing back - but, if you get it you could always send the ads to a non-existent email address (or a free one which you never check)... Hmm... It'd probably go out of business, but its free.... Martin -- Email: poohsticks@bonbon.net ICQ#: 11077801 AOL/CServeIM: Flupert From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 5 08:52:21 1999 Message-ID: <002801beaf27$cc3eb6c0$6ab259c3@l2u4e5> From: "Peter Harkess" To: Subject: Anybody know Dave W`s e-mail address Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 08:48:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 184 Lines: 11 As it say`s does anybody know Dave Whitmore`s e-mail address as i`ve just wiped all my mail and forgot to take note of e-mail addresses. DOH!! cheers Peter Harkess From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 5 09:56:32 1999 Message-ID: <000601beaf30$a9188500$8c5008c3@persona> From: "David L" To: Subject: Re: Anybody Know Dave W`s mail addr Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 09:51:32 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1014 Lines: 41 Switch to Clara Call if you're on BT - cheaper than "free"! -----Original Message----- From: Dave Whitmore To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: 04 June 1999 21:55 Subject: Re: Anybody Know Dave W`s mail addr Thanks for using NetForward! http://www.netforward.com v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v On Fri, 04 Jun 1999 18:17:28 +0100 Fri, 4 Jun 99 21:35:48 BST, Martin Fitzpatrick wrote: >hullo.... Hallieow >its.... > >davegw@clara.co.uk ^ I'm afraid it isn't. :) >...though he probably got your message on the list!! That's true though. davgw@clara.co.uk for now, but I might go to one of the free ones. It seems daft throwing 11 quid a month away these days. Then again, I've heard that there are trials running ATM by an ISP in Brum where you pay a flat tenner a month and you can dial up free and stay on (downloading MP3s and naughty pictures) for as long as you like. Sounds good to me! :-) Bye Dave From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 5 19:29:43 1999 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 19:16:49 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Stuart Brady Subject: Re: The win32 SIM Coupe In-Reply-To: <013201beadbc$b73c93d0$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Trial Version 3.05 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 473 Lines: 12 On Thu, 3 Jun 1999, Aley Keprt wrote: >Since it is noncommercial product, people doing Win32 version >probably won't have sufficient resources (time, ability, ...) to do anything >with Linux. Sorry. Please, just *DON'T* make it dependant on DOS/Windows, whatever you do. I know you don't care much about anything other than DOS/Windows, Aley, but please be careful not to ruin anything. You don't have to work on the Linux code - just keep it how it is. -- Stuart Brady From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 5 20:17:48 1999 Message-ID: <005301beafcb$15bd4520$47d4b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> From: "jadams1" To: Subject: help/disk mags Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 20:17:16 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 256 Lines: 6 I have just returned to the Sam scene but i have lost all my masterdos/utility disks.Can someone sell me the dos disk so i can start using the Sam again.Are there any disks mags still around or is format publication still going?Please do help me/ j adams From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 5 21:45:44 1999 Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 21:40:26 +0100 (BST) From: Andrew Collier X-Sender: asc25@red.csi.cam.ac.uk To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: help/disk mags In-Reply-To: <005301beafcb$15bd4520$47d4b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1767 Lines: 46 On Sat, 5 Jun 1999, jadams1 wrote: > I have just returned to the Sam scene but i have lost all my > masterdos/utility disks.Can someone sell me the dos disk so i can start > using the Sam again.Are there any disks mags still around or is format > publication still going?Please do help me/ > j adams MasterDos is the only DOS you'd need to pay for. SamDos2 isn't technically free, but everybody treats it as if it was. B-DOS is a freeware implementation of SamDOS with a few extra features, including support for the Atom hard disk interface. Have a look at ftp://ftp.nvg.ntnu.no/pub/sam-coupe/ In there you'll find lots of disk images for various utilities, games, demos. All freeware. The problem is that most of the files will be stored as .dsk files, or compressed versions. These are a raw disk dump which are very easy to produce by dd on Linux, or you can use Samdsk on a DOS PC to transfer the files onto a floppy. Unfortunately the floppy will probably need to be formatted first... The SAM uses an unusual format (2 sides, 80 tracks per side, 10 sectors per track, 512 bytes per sector) and I don't know of any PC programs which can format it... can anyone correct me? Possibly it can be done under Linux. Alternatively, look for a .TD0 on the ftp site. Assuming your PC can run Teledisk - and not all can, especially newer models - that will at least format the disk corectly. If all else fails, send me your snail-mail address and I'll put a floppy in the post. HTH Andrew -- | Andrew Collier | email asc25@cam.ac.uk | Talk sense | | Part 2 NatSci | http://carou.sel.cam.ac.uk/ | to a fool | +----------------+-----------------------------+ and he calls | | Selwyn College Student Computer Support Team | you foolish | From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 6 15:27:46 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: prawn.dcs.warwick.ac.uk: csuan owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 15:22:38 +0100 (BST) From: Paul Walker To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Anybody Know Dave W`s mail addr In-Reply-To: <000601beaf30$a9188500$8c5008c3@persona> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 134 Lines: 8 On Sat, 5 Jun 1999, David L wrote: > Switch to Clara Call if you're on BT - cheaper than "free"! They pay you to make calls? Paul From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 6 15:36:20 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: prawn.dcs.warwick.ac.uk: csuan owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 15:34:17 +0100 (BST) From: Paul Walker To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The win32 SIM Coupe In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 453 Lines: 12 On Sat, 5 Jun 1999, Stuart Brady wrote: > Please, just *DON'T* make it dependant on DOS/Windows, whatever you do. > I know you don't care much about anything other than DOS/Windows, Aley, > but please be careful not to ruin anything. You don't have to work on I don't think Aley's actually doing anything other than the sound driver. If that becomes too dependant on Windows, then someone just writes a Unix sound driver to take it's place. ;) Paul From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 6 15:44:28 1999 Message-ID: <000401beb022$94360f20$935008c3@persona> From: "David L" To: Subject: Re: Anybody Know Dave W`s mail addr Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 14:43:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 495 Lines: 23 Read the web site.... www.clara.net -----Original Message----- From: Paul Walker To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: 06 June 1999 15:34 Subject: Re: Anybody Know Dave W`s mail addr >Thanks for using NetForward! >http://www.netforward.com >v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v > >On Sat, 5 Jun 1999, David L wrote: > >> Switch to Clara Call if you're on BT - cheaper than "free"! > >They pay you to make calls? > >Paul > > > > From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 7 05:14:32 1999 Message-ID: <007901beb099$bc74ab00$99d1b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> From: "jadams1" To: Subject: PC to Sam Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 20:33:21 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 704 Lines: 11 Can anyone explain to me how can i transfer dsk files downloaded from the internet vie a PC to a Sam computer?The software needed and any problems I may incounter. Does anyone know if Sam PD is still going or have Derek Morgan's address? He was very helpfull to me in the past. Are the Gloucester show's still going ? I have tried to email format publications about some software and hardware i need (2nd disk drive interface) but their address(Formatpub@aol.com) was returned to me. I have also rang thei phone no but I could not got an answer either. Does anyone know what. the last issue no of Format was. As a user who need help with their Sam i need to know where i can go for help now? john adams From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 7 14:50:04 1999 Message-Id: <004901beb0e9$bf3b84d0$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: Subject: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 15:29:18 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by mail.comlab.ox.ac.uk id OAA06258 Status: RO Content-Length: 2265 Lines: 59 ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Walker To: Sent: 6. června 1999 16:34 Subject: Re: The win32 SIM Coupe > On Sat, 5 Jun 1999, Stuart Brady wrote: > > > Please, just *DON'T* make it dependant on DOS/Windows, whatever you do. > > I know you don't care much about anything other than DOS/Windows, Aley, > > but please be careful not to ruin anything. You don't have to work on > > I don't think Aley's actually doing anything other than the sound driver. > If that becomes too dependant on Windows, then someone just writes a Unix > sound driver to take it's place. ;) > > Paul > > > That's partially right. I keep working on DOS version. Since Si Owen doesn't want to release his sources (I hate him for this), I can't do much and I'm affraid Linux is out for now, since DOS is out too. In addition I'd like to ask this: Why Linux users don't make their version first and give us their sources? It is very easy to say: "Make you Win version Linux compatible." I bet everybody can say this, but not too many people can really do something for Linux, what will be usable for "our" ;) Win32 version. And of course many of them don't know much on the Win32 programming, when they say "keep current SimCoupe's menu". I'm really sorry, but I must say I don't like this people! I hope Si Owen will continue making ***Win32*** version. Another task is how Win32 programmers can exactly know what is "Linux friendly" in C++ source? Also, I think Linux users can simply use DOS version. Or not? Why not? Either use DOS emulator (change Sim Coupe for DOS a bit, if the current version doesn't work in DOS emulator), or simply use a boot disk with DOS. Many Linux users I know have DOS installed on their computer too. So what's the problem? I'm sorry for this negative mail, but I'm really frustrated of all these Linux activists..... "If you often say "Do this...", then you should shut up and do it yourself." ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 7 18:46:17 1999 Message-ID: <375C011D.A29725CC@btinternet.com> Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 18:27:57 +0100 From: Thomas Harte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: PC to Sam References: <007901beb099$bc74ab00$99d1b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 908 Lines: 19 > Can anyone explain to me how can i transfer dsk files downloaded from the > internet vie a PC to a Sam computer?The software needed and any problems I On NVG there are two programs that can do this for you - samdisk and samdsk. Neither has any real advantage when transferring to floppy, except that samdsk does a not run under a win95 DOS box for me. When transferring from floppy however, it is only samdsk that can handle bad sectors. So it is all swings and roundabouts there. Both have different command line options, and the only error I can think of if you have good disk media is that your disk drive may refuse to work with the floppy disk. Though no-one has ever complained about that happening before. People often say it is a good idea to have the disk you are transferring to SAM formatted already, but I've never had that problem. [cut] Ummm, don't know anything else, sorry. -Thomas From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 7 18:46:18 1999 Message-ID: <375C024C.E6A4A6B1@btinternet.com> Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 18:33:00 +0100 From: Thomas Harte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? References: <004901beb0e9$bf3b84d0$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1103 Lines: 25 > Since Si Owen doesn't want to release his sources (I hate him for this), > I can't do much and I'm affraid Linux is out for now, since DOS is out too. Hey, Sim Coupe was distributed under the GPL license. If Si doesn't want to surrender the modified source then he is breaking the law, and many people within the GPL sphere are perfectly happy to help fight if this is the case. A win32 Sim boycott anyone? > I think Linux users can simply use DOS version. Or not? Why not? > Either use DOS emulator (change Sim Coupe for DOS a bit, if the current > version doesn't work in DOS emulator), or simply use a boot disk with DOS. > Many Linux users I know have DOS installed on their computer too. > So what's the problem? I think the principle is this : an open source package for X-Windows which was written in Linux can usually be taken to work and compiled on a DEC or an Alpha . . . . machines which can not have DOS on them. > I'm sorry for this negative mail, but I'm really frustrated of all these > Linux activists..... Hey man, so am I, and I use the stupid operating system! -Thomas From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 7 19:28:00 1999 Message-Id: <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> Date: Fri, 04 Jun 1999 08:44:58 GMT To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: James@curry.com (James R Curry) Subject: The continuing saga... X-Mailer: Mozilla/4.0 (Windows 3.95;US) Opera 3.60b3 [en] X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.unit.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 152 Lines: 5 squabble squabble squabble Linux *squak* *squak* *squak* WIN32, squabble Simcoupe *squak* Linux, Linux GPL squablle, *squak* *squak*! -- James R Curry From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 7 20:29:06 1999 Message-ID: <375C1C4A.21FA50EE@btinternet.com> Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 20:23:54 +0100 From: Thomas Harte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... References: <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 714 Lines: 14 > squabble squabble squabble Linux *squak* *squak* *squak* WIN32, squabble Simcoupe > *squak* Linux, Linux GPL squablle, *squak* *squak*! Here is an interesting fact : Si has broken the distribution agreement with which he got the source for Sim Coupe. If you think that is an acceptable thing to do in order to further the popularity of Sam emulation, why not upload a whole load of .dsk files of games yourself? Sure, David Ledbury and most of the rest of us wouldn't be happy, and you'd have broken the license agreement under which you acquired the software - but 'squabble squabble Sam Coupe *squak* *squak* *squak* IBM PC, squabble, Simcoupe *squak* .dsk, data protection act, *squak* *squak*!" -Thomas From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 7 20:43:02 1999 X-Sender: asc25@pop.hermes.cam.ac.uk Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <375C1C4A.21FA50EE@btinternet.com> References: <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 20:39:48 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: Re: The continuing saga... X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1366 Lines: 39 >> squabble squabble squabble Linux *squak* *squak* *squak* WIN32, squabble >>Simcoupe >> *squak* Linux, Linux GPL squablle, *squak* *squak*! > > Here is an interesting fact : Si has broken the distribution agreement >with which he got the source for Sim Coupe. Point 1: Oh no he hasn't. He has modified GPL source to produce the development version of SimCoupe Win32. But since he is not distributing a binary of SimCoupe Win32, he is under *no* obligation to release his modifications to the source. Point 2: Give him time. I'm sure that, when the time comes for SimCoupe Win32 to be released, and Si Owen distributes the binary, I'm sure that he will also distribute the source. And when that happens, the Linux programmers can start working those modifications back into the Linux source tree. > If you think that is an >acceptable thing to do in order to further the popularity of Sam >emulation, why not upload a whole load of .dsk files of games yourself? What are you going on about? Distributing a bunch of pirated games is not the same as developing a new version of SimCoupe. Andrew -- | Andrew Collier | email asc25@cam.ac.uk | Talk sense to a | Part 2 NatSci | http://carou.sel.cam.ac.uk/ | fool and he +----------------+----------------ICQ:38645805-+ calls you foolish | Selwyn College Student Computer Support Team | -- Euripides From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 7 21:14:51 1999 Message-ID: <19990607201303.37573.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [131.107.3.79] From: "Simon Cooke" To: References: <004901beb0e9$bf3b84d0$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> <375C024C.E6A4A6B1@btinternet.com> Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 13:10:50 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.2300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.2300 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 424 Lines: 11 > Hey, Sim Coupe was distributed under the GPL license. If Si doesn't > want to surrender the modified source then he is breaking the law, and > many people within the GPL sphere are perfectly happy to help fight if > this is the case. > Interestingly, the GPL has never been proven in court. Simon Cooke (The views of this poster are his and his alone, and may or may not reflect the views of the Microsoft Corporation). From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 7 22:14:17 1999 Message-ID: <375C3200.4ABA6BA0@btinternet.com> Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 21:56:32 +0100 From: Thomas Harte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... References: <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 687 Lines: 17 > Point 1: Oh no he hasn't. > > He has modified GPL source to produce the development version of SimCoupe > Win32. But since he is not distributing a binary of SimCoupe Win32, he is > under *no* obligation to release his modifications to the source. Actually I am told there is a binary in private distribution. I could name at least one person who has seen it - but that wouldn't be fair! > What are you going on about? Distributing a bunch of pirated games is not > the same as developing a new version of SimCoupe. How is abusing one copyright different to abusing another? (except that according to an earlier Simon Cooke post, the GPL has not been proved in court) -Thomas From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 7 23:49:42 1999 X-Sender: asc25@pop.hermes.cam.ac.uk Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <375C3200.4ABA6BA0@btinternet.com> References: <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 23:45:14 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: Re: The continuing saga... X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1704 Lines: 45 >> Point 1: Oh no he hasn't. >> >> He has modified GPL source to produce the development version of SimCoupe >> Win32. But since he is not distributing a binary of SimCoupe Win32, he is >> under *no* obligation to release his modifications to the source. > > Actually I am told there is a binary in private distribution. I could >name at least one person who has seen it - but that wouldn't be fair! Unfortunately, the GPL does not clearly define its use of the term "distribution". I would say that if Simon does not make the binary generally available, then there is no requirement to make the source generally available. Like I said, give him time. I'm sure that the source will be properly released as soon as the binary is. Note that the developer of SimCoupe/MacOS has also neglected to distribute the source - and he *is* distributing the binary. >> What are you going on about? Distributing a bunch of pirated games is not >> the same as developing a new version of SimCoupe. > > How is abusing one copyright different to abusing another? He's not abusing copyright. But even if he were, the situations are entirely asymmetric. The copyright-owners of the games will suffer financial loss due to piracy. Allan Skillman would not suffer financial loss due to the distribution of SimCoupe Win32. Simon can mend the damage by starting to distribute his own source. You can't mend damage by undistributing pirated games. Andrew -- | Andrew Collier | email asc25@cam.ac.uk | Talk sense to a | Part 2 NatSci | http://carou.sel.cam.ac.uk/ | fool and he +----------------+----------------ICQ:38645805-+ calls you foolish | Selwyn College Student Computer Support Team | -- Euripides From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 8 00:20:45 1999 X-Sender: asc25@pop.hermes.cam.ac.uk Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 00:18:19 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: Change of URL - mnemotech.ucam.org X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 872 Lines: 28 Well - it's getting toward the end of my third year at Selwyn College, Cambridge; that means carou.sel.cam.ac.uk will shortly be going offline, permanently. Fortunately, I've been able to organise a new home for my Sam-related content, so why not browse to the following URL: http://mnemotech.ucam.org/ These new-look pages still include: - all MNEMOtech releases and older ILLUSION software programs - Zodiac magazine afticles including Second Opinion - the Sam DemoBase - Sam-users users page and Gloucester showpics If your pages currently refer to carou.sel, plase update your links. Andrew -- | Andrew Collier | email asc25@cam.ac.uk | Talk sense to a | Part 2 NatSci | http://carou.sel.cam.ac.uk/ | fool and he +----------------+----------------ICQ:38645805-+ calls you foolish | Selwyn College Student Computer Support Team | -- Euripides From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 8 00:27:20 1999 Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 00:26:32 +0100 (GMT) From: Robert Brady To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? In-Reply-To: <19990607201303.37573.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 650 Lines: 19 On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Simon Cooke wrote: > > Hey, Sim Coupe was distributed under the GPL license. If Si doesn't > > want to surrender the modified source then he is breaking the law, and > > many people within the GPL sphere are perfectly happy to help fight if > > this is the case. > > > > Interestingly, the GPL has never been proven in court. There have been several out of court disputes, some against companies with expensive lawyers (e.g. NeXT). The offending company has backed down in every instance. And even if it was found to be invalid, it would not allow people to steal GPLed source code and make proprietary versions. -- Robert. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 8 11:59:05 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: stone.dcs.warwick.ac.uk: csuan owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 11:57:04 +0100 (BST) From: Paul Walker To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? In-Reply-To: <004901beb0e9$bf3b84d0$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1651 Lines: 44 On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Aley Keprt wrote: > Since Si Owen doesn't want to release his sources (I hate him for this), Probably just for the same reason I haven't yet released Hurricane source - it's not ready. > In addition I'd like to ask this: Why Linux users don't make their version > first and > give us their sources? It is very easy to say: "Make you Win version Linux Okay; would you like the .tar.gz emailed to that address, or another one? In case you weren't aware, SimCoupe actually *started* as a Linux program. With source. > Another task is how Win32 programmers can exactly know what is "Linux > friendly" in C++ source? Just generally good programming practice - keep the platform-dependant stuff to a minimum of places (one "routine-library" is best), and write proper ANSI C++ rather than some bastardisation. If you do that, then code will compile cleanly with a minimum of alteration under many platforms. > I think Linux users can simply use DOS version. Or not? Why not? Because the DOS version hasn't been developed for some time. The Win32 version *is* in active development. Or are you suggesting that people should all switch to win32 just to get up-to-date code? :-) > I'm sorry for this negative mail, but I'm really frustrated of all these > Linux activists..... I'm annoyed with the people who think *everything* should be linux based, and no-one has reasons for using anything else. That's a little different, though. > "If you often say "Do this...", then you should shut up and do it yourself." Small problem with lack of time at the present; more important things to worry about than SAM in any form. Paul From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 8 13:14:57 1999 Message-ID: <375DA275.D1CC53C2@clear.net.nz> Date: Wed, 09 Jun 1999 00:08:37 +0100 From: James Gasson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... References: <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 6820 Lines: 140 Andrew Collier wrote: > Unfortunately, the GPL does not clearly define its use of the term > "distribution". I would say that if Simon does not make the binary > generally available, then there is no requirement to make the source > generally available. > > Like I said, give him time. I'm sure that the source will be properly > released as soon as the binary is. I hope so, and I don't suppose that would be being unreasonable. > Note that the developer of SimCoupe/MacOS has also neglected to > distribute the source - and he *is* distributing the binary. The bastard! (...) > He's not abusing copyright. > > But even if he were, the situations are entirely asymmetric. The > copyright-owners of the games will suffer financial loss due to > piracy. Allan Skillman would not suffer financial loss due to the > distribution of SimCoupe Win32. > > Simon can mend the damage by starting to distribute his own source. > You can't mend damage by undistributing pirated games. I would disagree about the situations being asymmetric. My own view is that copyright and "copyleft" (as it is sometimes called) are actually quite similar, and if you'll bare with me for a minute or two, I'll try to explain why. When you obtain and use a copy of a commercial program, you enter into an agreement with the copyright holder. The reason for this is that: 1/ The author(s) could have decided not to make the program available had they wished, in which case they would have been able to benefit from it, and you would not. 2/ However, you wish to have access to the program. 3/ Therefore a mutually benificial agreement is made where by you pay some money, and are allowed restricted access to the program. Basically, you have access to the program, but under certain situations (such as when you swap data with friends) you have to act as though you didn't have access to the program. ie. You may not distribute pirated software. For "copyleft", the reasoning is quite similar. When you obtain and use a copy of source code released under a GPL licence, you enter into a "copyleft" agreement. The reason being: 1/ The author(s) could have decided not to make the source available had they wished, in which case they would have been able to benefit from it, and you would not. 2/ However, you wish to have access to the source. 3/ Therefore a mutually benificial agreement is made where by you are allowed restricted access to the source. Basically, you have access to the source, but under certain situations (such as when you write a non GPL program) you have to act as though you didn't have access to the source. ie. You may not hijack open source software for use in you own non open source programs. Written like this, there are really only 2 differences between copyright and "copyleft". One is that people (generally) have to pay to obtain a program under a copyright licence. The other is that the rights that people forfit when entering into the agreements are different. People entering into a copyright licence forfit the right to give away the code, where as people entering into a "copyleft" licence forfit the right to use the code in a non open source program. I also question your statement that people do not suffer loss due to GPL licences being broken. (Ok, so what you actually say is "financial loss", but I would suggest that whether a loss is "financial" or not is quite beside the point. There are plenty of situations where people receive legal redress for a non financial loss. In the case of GPL licences being broken, the loss in question is loss of access to source.) Now, you might (quite rightly) ask in what sence can someone be said to have lost something that they never had (ie. how can access to source have been lost, when the source would never have even existed if it weren't for the person who is supposedly breaking the "copyleft" agreement.) However, this "victemless crime" argument is exactly the same one often used by software pirates. Let me expand on this. You say that copyright holders suffer financial loss when programs are pirated (a more pricise version of the common slogan "piracy is theft"), but consider this: say I have 1000 pirated games that retail for $100 each (which by the way I don't. this scenario is somewhat of an exageration perhaps, but not entirely implausible). If the statement is literally true that "piracy is theft" (and we consider "theft" here to be in the traditional sence) then, by copying these games, I have stolen $100,000 of money that would otherwise belong to the copyright holder(s). Now, this is clearly absurd. I never had $100,000 to spend on games (or anything else for that matter), so there is no way they would have got this money from me, and I can't possibly have cheated them of it. (Well, actually it IS literally true that "piracy is theft", at least by the legal defination of theft, but this definition is a somewhat contorted version of the traditional idea of theft.) None of this matters, of course. I have still broken a law when I pirate a game, and there's a very good reason for that. The copyright system (despite all it's flaws) is the best method we currently have for re-imbursing software developers for their efforts. Simply put, if the copyright system weren't in place, noone would pay for any software, and it wouldn't get written. (Of course this doesn't make as good a slogan as the less accurate "piracy is theft"). Getting back to the GPL side, yes, you are correct, strictly speaking, when you say that people do not directly suffer loss due to a GPL licence being broken (in the same way that piracy is a victemless crime). But if there was no "copyleft" licence, and people were free to use the source in their propritery systems, this could have just as a disastorious effect on the open source scene as the lack of a copyright law could have on the commercial software scene. Even if you don't agree with that, regardless of whether or not the situation is "asymmetric", it is still the law. And, as is the case for copyright, from a practical point of view, at the individual level, this more convincing than any moral argument. And finally, yes the dammage could be _partially_ mended by distributing the source after the event (there is still the setback in progress caused by the source not being made available sooner). But in the same way, the loss to commercial software vendors could be _partially_ mended by (as you say) undistributing the commercial software -- or to be more precise, by convincing the person/people who recieved pirated software from you to dispose of it. Ideally by replacing it with an equilivant, except better, open source program. ;-p P.S. I like open source, especially gcc and ghostscript. -- James Gasson no.spam.james.gasson@clear.net.nz From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 00:10:43 1999 X-Sender: asc25@pop.hermes.cam.ac.uk Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <375DA275.D1CC53C2@clear.net.nz> References: <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 00:07:17 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 4148 Lines: 90 At 12:08 am +0100 9/6/99, James Gasson wrote: >Andrew Collier wrote: >> But even if he were, the situations are entirely asymmetric. The >> copyright-owners of the games will suffer financial loss due to >> piracy. Allan Skillman would not suffer financial loss due to the >> distribution of SimCoupe Win32. >> >> Simon can mend the damage by starting to distribute his own source. >> You can't mend damage by undistributing pirated games. > > >I would disagree about the situations being asymmetric. I agree with _most_ of what you said. Breaking any law or legal agreement is not acceptable. I'm certainly not advocating that Simon should deliberately breach the GPL. However - I still don't accept that distributing a bunch of pirated games is comparable to not distributing source for a new version of SimCoupe. Certainly I don't think that it could ever be an appropriate reaction, as Thomas was perhaps suggesting. Distributing pirated games will have a detrimental effect on the entire Sam community, including those who use real hardware as well as emulation. Any change in the distribution of the emulator can naturally effect only those who use the emulator. (Strictly speaking, I suppose that any change in part of the community may have a knock-on effect on the rest of the community, but I would consider this at most a second order effect). Besides, Si isn't breaking GPL, as he isn't distributing a binary. And the GPL is flawed anyway - Si might assert that his code to interface to Win32 instead of Linux is a differentiable work, in which case the GPL doesn't need to cover it. Anyway, none of this changes the fact that the Linux source was, is, and will in future still be available. > Simply put, if the >copyright system weren't in place, noone would pay for any software, and >it wouldn't get written. I disagree, look at Linux. Or indeed, any piece of free software (I mean zero-cost "Freeware" as well as open-source Free software.) These don't depend on copyright laws, but people still write it. >And finally, yes the dammage could be _partially_ mended by distributing >the source after the event (there is still the setback in progress >caused by the source not being made available sooner). Fair enough. >But in the same >way, the loss to commercial software vendors could be _partially_ mended >by (as you say) undistributing the commercial software -- or to be more >precise, by convincing the person/people who recieved pirated software >from you to dispose of it. No - you *cannot* "undistribute" the pirated games. In all likelyhood they were uploaded to an anonymous ftp server, and it won't be possible to trace the people who downloaded it. Once people have got it, they're got it. The damage is done, and can't be undone. >P.S. I like open source, especially gcc and ghostscript. I like Open Source, but I don't like GPL. It is flawed, sometimes rather loosely defined, and doesn't give the original programmer enough rights, eg to make a distinction between an official and non-official distribution. It is probably the most restrictive "freedom" I've come across, free in only the exact way that loony Richard Stallman has chosen to define it (his philosophy seems to be that any programmer who ever distributes a non-GPL program is scum, and Deserves To Have His Program Pirated).... Personally I think that (under most circumstances) the programmer should be allowed to distribute his own code under whatever terms he likes. The sort of people who distribute GPL code at the moment, would probably continue to do so - even if they are forced not to. But it might just encourage other people to develop software; people who are currently scared off by the infectious GPL, but would happpily distribute under weaker terms. The sooner the world stops using the GPL and replaces it with a more sane scheme, the better IMHO. Andrew -- | Andrew Collier | email asc25@cam.ac.uk | Talk sense to a | Part 2 NatSci | http://carou.sel.cam.ac.uk/ | fool and he +----------------+----------------ICQ:38645805-+ calls you foolish | Selwyn College Student Computer Support Team | -- Euripides From imc@comlab.ox.ac.uk Wed Jun 9 01:18:06 1999 Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 01:18:06 +0100 From: Ian Collier To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) Message-ID: <19990609011806.A18066@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mail-Followup-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no References: <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> <375DA275.D1CC53C2@clear.net.nz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Andrew Collier on Wed, Jun 09, 1999 at 12:07:17AM +0100 Status: RO Content-Length: 1658 Lines: 35 On Wed, Jun 09, 1999 at 12:07:17AM +0100, Andrew Collier wrote: > And the > GPL is flawed anyway - Si might assert that his code to interface to Win32 > instead of Linux is a differentiable work, in which case the GPL doesn't > need to cover it. Not at all - the rules are very strict on this point. To be able to claim that, Si needs to distribute something that doesn't contain *any* of SimCoupe, so that you can then get the official SimCoupe and run them together to make the final product - and even then that's unlikely to be allowed because the result could be considered a derivative work (that's why the LGPL exist). > I like Open Source, but I don't like GPL. It is flawed, sometimes rather > loosely defined, and doesn't give the original programmer enough rights Whatever it is I don't think "loosely defined" could ever be applied to it. Also, the original programmer has any rights he pleases because he owns the copyright and can release a separate version of the work under a different licence (what he can't do of course is prevent the original version from being distributed under the GPL). > Personally I think that (under most circumstances) the programmer should be > allowed to distribute his own code under whatever terms he likes. No one forces programmers to apply one licence or another to their code. What are you on about? > The > sooner the world stops using the GPL and replaces it with a more sane > scheme, the better IMHO. Careful. Xz80 is distributed under the GPL, you know. imc From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 02:51:41 1999 X-Sender: asc25@pop.hermes.cam.ac.uk Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19990609011806.A18066@comlab.ox.ac.uk> References: ; from Andrew Collier on Wed, Jun 09, 1999 at 12:07:17AM +0100 <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> <375DA275.D1CC53C2@clear.net.nz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 02:46:29 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 4053 Lines: 92 >On Wed, Jun 09, 1999 at 12:07:17AM +0100, Andrew Collier wrote: >> And the >> GPL is flawed anyway - Si might assert that his code to interface to Win32 >> instead of Linux is a differentiable work, in which case the GPL doesn't >> need to cover it. > >Not at all - the rules are very strict on this point. To be able to >claim that, Si needs to distribute something that doesn't contain *any* >of SimCoupe, so that you can then get the official SimCoupe and run them >together to make the final product - and even then that's unlikely to be >allowed because the result could be considered a derivative work (that's >why the LGPL exist). >From paragraph 2: >If identifiable sections of that work are not derived from the Program, >and can be reasonably considered independent and separate works in >themselves, then this License, and its terms, do not apply to those >sections when you distribute them as separate works. Okay, I've just noticed that they indeed do have to be distributed seperately, but that should then fit the terms. Actually, since the LGPL was changed a few months ago, the infection principle is almost as strong as in GPL (ie. loony RMS has broken the LGPL beyond repair). >> I like Open Source, but I don't like GPL. It is flawed, sometimes rather >> loosely defined, and doesn't give the original programmer enough rights SNIP! > >Whatever it is I don't think "loosely defined" could ever be applied to it. In that case, where does it define "distribution"? Does it count, for example, if a few copies of the binary have been given to beta testers but that the source has not? >Also, the original programmer has any rights he pleases because he owns the >copyright and can release a separate version of the work under a different >licence (what he can't do of course is prevent the original version from >being distributed under the GPL). Why not quote half a sentence and then complain that the first half doesn't make complete sense, eh? Better licenses give the original programmer magic extra rights which are not passed on to subsequent developers, ie that only the original programmer can produce an official distribution. But consider A, who writes a program called Foo v1.0, released GPL. A continues development, and releases Foo v1.1, released GPL. B develops from Foo v1.0 source, and releases Foo v1.1 - which is now totally incompatible with A's program. The GPL doesn't prevent this. But we now have two different, incompatible products with the same name. And of course everybody gets confused, and if B's modification stops working, then as likely as not it'll be A that gets the rude emails and support requests. >> Personally I think that (under most circumstances) the programmer should be >> allowed to distribute his own code under whatever terms he likes. > >No one forces programmers to apply one licence or another to their code. >What are you on about? Si Owen, for example, has no choice of what license is applied to SimCoupe Win32, because it is originally derived from a GPL program. The GPL is infectious - ie any derivatives MUST be distributed according to the GPL. And this is why many commercial companies, for example, won't use their skills to enhance GPL software - because it would necessarily involve losing the benefit of too much sensitive IP. >> The >> sooner the world stops using the GPL and replaces it with a more sane >> scheme, the better IMHO. > >Careful. Xz80 is distributed under the GPL, you know. And? Andrew PS. This is getting *way* off topic. Can we do something more appropriate with it? It's been a while since anyone posted to oxbridge.tat; perhaps... -- | Andrew Collier | email asc25@cam.ac.uk | Talk sense to a | Part 2 NatSci | http://carou.sel.cam.ac.uk/ | fool and he +----------------+----------------ICQ:38645805-+ calls you foolish | Selwyn College Student Computer Support Team | -- Euripides From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 03:28:30 1999 Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 03:26:14 +0100 (GMT) From: Robert Brady To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1426 Lines: 31 On Wed, 9 Jun 1999, Andrew Collier wrote: > From paragraph 2: > > >If identifiable sections of that work are not derived from the Program, > >and can be reasonably considered independent and separate works in > >themselves, then this License, and its terms, do not apply to those > >sections when you distribute them as separate works. > > Okay, I've just noticed that they indeed do have to be distributed > seperately, but that should then fit the terms. Actually, since the LGPL > was changed a few months ago, the infection principle is almost as strong > as in GPL (ie. loony RMS has broken the LGPL beyond repair). Um, no. All LGPL2.1 does is to fix some typos, explicitly allow dynamically linking, and to rename from "Library" to "Lesser". And RMS is not a loony. He may have different axioms than you, but his arguments from those axioms are a good sight more well-reasoned than name calling. See for more details. I can't understand why some people dislike the GPL : it is only there to stop people exploiting the efforts of others in creating non-proprietary software by making proprietary derivatives. That is the right of the author of software. It is significantly less restrictive than proprietary software licenses, which typically don't allow redistribution at all! -- Robert who can't remember the last time he bought a license to use some proprietary software From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 03:56:36 1999 Message-ID: <19990609025518.65153.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [131.107.3.71] From: Simon Cooke To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) Date: Tue, 08 Jun 1999 19:55:18 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 5236 Lines: 108 >From: Robert Brady >And RMS is not a loony. He may have different axioms than you, but his >arguments from those axioms are a good sight more well-reasoned than name >calling. See for more details. Mmmmmm.... well reasoned yeah? Try reading the GNU Manifesto: http://www.gnu.org/gnu/manifesto.html "But that is not an argument against the change. It is not considered an injustice that sales clerks make the salaries that they now do. If programmers made the same, that would not be an injustice either." Lovely. So, someone who dropped out of school, has an IQ of 78, and knows how to push a few buttons on a cash register and STILL has to call out over the intercom "Tracy... how much is this can of Tomatoes?" should be earning as much as me, when I've trained myself for over 15 years to perform an art and craft that is a damn sight more challenging? "Copying all or parts of a program is as natural to a programmer as breathing, and as productive. It ought to be as free." However, that doesn't take into account any concept of Intellectual Property, which is a very important one. ""Don't programmers deserve a reward for their creativity?" If anything deserves a reward, it is social contribution. Creativity can be a social contribution, but only in so far as society is free to use the results. If programmers deserve to be rewarded for creating innovative programs, by the same token they deserve to be punished if they restrict the use of these programs. " Nice concept - shame it doesn't match up with any concept of what the real world is like. Mr. Stallman took too much acid in the 70s. But back to the skill thing... ""Won't programmers starve?" I could answer that nobody is forced to be a programmer. Most of us cannot manage to get any money for standing on the street and making faces. But we are not, as a result, condemned to spend our lives standing on the street making faces, and starving. We do something else. " Mmmmm.... so writing programs is equivalent to standing on the street and making faces. Why doesn't Mr. Stallman want programmers to exist? Seems like he's a bit of a luddite to me. But here's the most important bit: "The idea of copyright did not exist in ancient times, when authors frequently copied other authors at length in works of non-fiction. This practice was useful, and is the only way many authors' works have survived even in part. The copyright system was created expressly for the purpose of encouraging authorship. In the domain for which it was invented--books, which could be copied economically only on a printing press--it did little harm, and did not obstruct most of the individuals who read the books. All intellectual property rights are just licenses granted by society because it was thought, rightly or wrongly, that society as a whole would benefit by granting them. But in any particular situation, we have to ask: are we really better off granting such license? What kind of act are we licensing a person to do? " Problem: Work needs to be paid for. This is the trade/barter system. It applies to all work; work is only done for something in return (unless that person chooses to do otherwise). Work is effectively what happens when someone spends their time on this planet doing something for someone else's benefit. Therefore, we can say when someone is performing "work" that someone is using their life up to benefit someone else, in return for which they will receive something of value. When it comes down to it then, why should intellectual property be any different to anything else? Just because programmers enjoy programming, that doesn't mean it isn't work -- it's fun, but it's still hard work. The same applies to all intellectual property, software or otherwise. This is why RMS's arguments fall; because they assume that because something's intangible, it shouldn't be possible to charge for it. But the thing is, that thing is always tangible - it's a chunk of MY LIFE that I'll never ever be able to get back. And as such, it's my decision what to do with it. Mr. Stallman wants a free ride. His notions of social strata, economic theory, anthropology and history are all very revisionistic and mutate to fit whichever argument he wants to make. The GPL and LGPL as they stood until recently were great ideas; take 'em or leave 'em. But to claim in any way that RMS is NOT as nutty as a fruitcake is to give him more credit than he could ever deserve. >I can't understand why some people dislike the GPL : it is only there to >stop people exploiting the efforts of others in creating non-proprietary >software by making proprietary derivatives. That is the right of the >author of software. It is significantly less restrictive than proprietary >software licenses, which typically don't allow redistribution at all! Yeah, but it preaches false altruism. Which is why when I release software for free, it goes under a variant of the FreeBSD license. Simon (Not speaking for Microsoft) _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 05:27:06 1999 Message-ID: <375E8287.5589BC3F@clear.net.nz> Date: Wed, 09 Jun 1999 16:04:39 +0100 From: James Gasson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) References: ; from Andrew Collier on Wed, Jun 09, 1999 at 12:07:17AM +0100 <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> <375DA275.D1CC53C2@clear.net.nz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 449 Lines: 12 Andrew Collier wrote: > Okay, I've just noticed that they indeed do have to be distributed > seperately, but that should then fit the terms. Actually, since the LGPL (...) > PS. This is getting *way* off topic. Can we do something more appropriate > with it? It's been a while since anyone posted to oxbridge.tat; perhaps... How about news:free.software.open-source ? I think this is a newish group, and it seems rather suitable. -- James Gasson From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 08:07:08 1999 From: "Si Owen" To: Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 08:05:10 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 In-Reply-To: <375C024C.E6A4A6B1@btinternet.com> Importance: Normal X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1086 Lines: 31 *takes a deep breath* Aley Keprt originally wrote: > > Since Si Owen doesn't want to release his sources (I hate him for this), Aley seems to have left out an all-important 'yet' from the end of this sentence, probably not intentionally. Thomas Harte then wrote: > Hey, Sim Coupe was distributed under the GPL license. If Si doesn't > want to surrender the modified source then he is breaking the law, and > many people within the GPL sphere are perfectly happy to help fight if > this is the case. I've always said that I would release the modified source when I'm done, and that's still what I intend to do. It's not available yet because I've not finished my changes, and I'm not going to be pressured into releasing it early. It'll be ready when it's ready - be patient! My spare time has been extremely limited recently, so I've not had a chance to work on it. With any luck things should start to get back to 'normal' in a few weeks time when some big work deadlines are out of the way and I'm back from holiday. > A win32 Sim boycott anyone? Get a life Thomas... Si From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 12:10:43 1999 X-Sender: asc25@pop.hermes.cam.ac.uk Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 12:04:53 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 1702 Lines: 41 At 3:26 am +0100 9/6/99, Robert Brady wrote: >On Wed, 9 Jun 1999, Andrew Collier wrote: > >> Actually, since the LGPL >> was changed a few months ago, the infection principle is almost as strong >> as in GPL (ie. loony RMS has broken the LGPL beyond repair). > >Um, no. All LGPL2.1 does is to fix some typos, explicitly allow >dynamically linking, and to rename from "Library" to "Lesser". What about paragraph 6 then, which now says: 6. As an exception to the Sections above, you may also combine or link a "work that uses the Library" with the Library to produce a work containing portions of the Library, and distribute that work under terms of your choice, provided that the terms permit modification of the work for the customer's own use and reverse engineering for debugging such modifications. So you can't have a non-free executable which is statically linked to a LGPL library. But a lot of people do that sort of thing, eg statically link your binary to glibc. I mean, there's enough flux in libc (especially on Linux) that statically linking makes the binary far more portable. And on *BSD the commonest distribution format is a statically linked a.out BSDI binary... >And RMS is not a loony. He may have different axioms than you, but his >arguments from those axioms are a good sight more well-reasoned than name >calling. See for more details. I've seen it, it's hilarious. Andrew -- | Andrew Collier | email asc25@cam.ac.uk | Talk sense to a | Part 2 NatSci | http://carou.sel.cam.ac.uk/ | fool and he +----------------+----------------ICQ:38645805-+ calls you foolish | Selwyn College Student Computer Support Team | -- Euripides From imc@comlab.ox.ac.uk Wed Jun 9 12:17:45 1999 Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 12:17:45 +0100 From: Ian Collier To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) Message-ID: <19990609121745.C18666@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mail-Followup-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Andrew Collier on Wed, Jun 09, 1999 at 12:04:53PM +0100 Status: RO Content-Length: 692 Lines: 15 On Wed, Jun 09, 1999 at 12:04:53PM +0100, Andrew Collier wrote: > But a lot of people do that sort of thing, eg statically link your binary > to glibc. I mean, there's enough flux in libc (especially on Linux) that > statically linking makes the binary far more portable. What are you talking about? The only program I know on Linux which is statically linked to libc is rpm, and there is a specific reason for that. Now admittedly most of the programs were supplied with the OS, but a notable exception is Netscape and that is dynamically linked. Also if you go to contrib.redhat you will most likely find that without exception all the contributed programs are dynamically linked. imc From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 12:40:13 1999 Message-ID: <0AEF0EB21F09D211AE4E0080C82733BF851AE6@mailhost.aculab.com> From: Justin Skists To: "'sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no'" Subject: RE: The continuing saga... (enough?) Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 12:44:58 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 465 Lines: 9 How come all we ever talk about these days is copyright issues? I always thought we were developers - not lawyers. Maybe it's a new trend? Once upon a time, when I were a lad, programmers wanted strut their stuff to big softwares houses by writing demos. Now, it seems that people, these days, still want to strut their stuff to the same big-guns but under a new light: arguments over licences... Justin (Not speaking for Aculab, MS, or any other software house) From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 17:06:23 1999 Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 17:03:15 +0100 (GMT) From: Robert Brady To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 607 Lines: 17 On Wed, 9 Jun 1999, Andrew Collier wrote: > 6. As an exception to the Sections above, you may also combine or link a > "work that uses the Library" with the Library to produce a work containing > portions of the Library, and distribute that work under terms of your > choice, provided that the terms permit modification of the work for the > customer's own use and reverse engineering for debugging such > modifications. > > So you can't have a non-free executable which is statically linked to a > LGPL library. Wow! The LGPL is actually fulfilling the intentions of its writer! Film at 11! -- Robert From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 17:22:40 1999 Message-ID: <000101beb2d6$93e73060$93d4b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> From: "jadams1" To: Subject: Based on an idea Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 20:25:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 112 Lines: 4 Does anyone have a spare copy of the above magazine I could buy as I would like to have a read of one. j adams From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 17:22:40 1999 Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 17:09:54 +0100 (GMT) From: Robert Brady To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 849 Lines: 19 On Wed, 9 Jun 1999, Andrew Collier wrote: > 6. As an exception to the Sections above, you may also combine or link a > "work that uses the Library" with the Library to produce a work containing > portions of the Library, and distribute that work under terms of your > choice, provided that the terms permit modification of the work for the > customer's own use and reverse engineering for debugging such > modifications. That bit has always been in the LGPL anyway. The only difference is this >- 6. As an exception to the Sections above, you may also compile or >+ 6. As an exception to the Sections above, you may also combine or > link a "work that uses the Library" with the Library to produce a > work containing portions of the Library, and distribute that work > under terms of your choice, provided that the terms permit -- Robert From imc@comlab.ox.ac.uk Wed Jun 9 17:40:32 1999 Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 17:40:32 +0100 From: Ian Collier To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) Message-ID: <19990609174031.D18666@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mail-Followup-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no References: ; <199906071817.NAA22281@mailhub.cns.ksu.edu> <375DA275.D1CC53C2@clear.net.nz> <19990609011806.A18066@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Andrew Collier on Wed, Jun 09, 1999 at 02:46:29AM +0100 Status: RO Content-Length: 2065 Lines: 46 On Wed, Jun 09, 1999 at 02:46:29AM +0100, Andrew Collier wrote: > >If identifiable sections of that work are not derived from the Program, > >and can be reasonably considered independent and separate works in > >themselves, then this License, and its terms, do not apply to those > >sections when you distribute them as separate works. > Okay, I've just noticed that they indeed do have to be distributed > seperately, but that should then fit the terms. Nope. Not only do they need to be distributed separately, but they also need to be considered independent works in themselves. A package calling itself "The Win32 version of Simcoupe - by the way you need SimCoupe to use this" hardly fits that description. > >Whatever it is I don't think "loosely defined" could ever be applied to it. > In that case, where does it define "distribution"? Does it count, for > example, if a few copies of the binary have been given to beta testers but > that the source has not? OK, this may be a grey area (but one grey area does not make the whole thing "loosely defined"). But giving it to a few selected beta testers counts as part of the development rather than distribution, I would say. > Better licenses give the original programmer magic extra rights which are > not passed on to subsequent developers, ie that only the original > programmer can produce an official distribution. > But consider A, who writes a program called Foo v1.0, released GPL. > A continues development, and releases Foo v1.1, released GPL. > B develops from Foo v1.0 source, and releases Foo v1.1 - which is now > totally incompatible with A's program. But note that B's version contains, in accordance with paragraph 2(a), prominent notices that B has carried out the modifications. If A thinks this is likely to be a problem he is perfectly free to amend the licence under which he distributes the program. > PS. This is getting *way* off topic. Can we do something more appropriate > with it? It's been a while since anyone posted to oxbridge.tat; perhaps... You first. imc From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 9 19:04:06 1999 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 18:54:19 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Stuart Brady Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? In-Reply-To: <004901beb0e9$bf3b84d0$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Trial Version 3.05 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 2694 Lines: 59 On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Aley Keprt wrote: >In addition I'd like to ask this: Why Linux users don't make their >version first and give us their sources? It is very easy to say: "Make >you Win version Linux compatible." I bet everybody can say this, but >not too many people can really do something for Linux, what will be >usable for "our" ;) Win32 version. The Win32 sources should include functions for DOS and Linux to avoid code forks, and development versions of a port should not add new features before the code is released. Basically, just keep all of your DOS/Win32/Linux dependant functions in seperate files, and everything should be fine. >Another task is how Win32 programmers can exactly know what is "Linux >friendly" in C++ source? It's hardly rocket science. I can't even program in C++, but even I've got a rough idea about how cross platform code is supposed to work. The actual emulation (the process, if you like) should compile from the same code for each platform. The input and output (graphics, sound, disk, keyboard, mouse) code should be placed in seperate files for each platform. If you do it properly, the new DOS/Win32 only features won't exist in Linux, but you'll still be able to compile from the same source. It's what's known as "conditional inclusion". :-) If you don't do this, you could end up with a dozen different versions of SimCoupe which have to be kept consistant with one another, but also try to stay one step ahead in terms of features. It'll be almost impossible to merge them into one cross-platform version, by then. Doom springs to mind here. I can name Boom, LxDoom, ZDoom, Doom Legacy, DOSDoom, GGIDoom, and XDoom (which are all open source) off the top of my head, and there are many more. You don't want this to happen to SimCoupe. >Also, >I think Linux users can simply use DOS version. Or not? Why not? >Either use DOS emulator (change Sim Coupe for DOS a bit, if the current >version doesn't work in DOS emulator), or simply use a boot disk with DOS. >Many Linux users I know have DOS installed on their computer too. >So what's the problem? Why do you think people use Linux in the first place? If people want to write Linux code for SimCoupe, why can't they? Just make sure that you don't break the Linux code, and I'm not complaining. >I'm sorry for this negative mail, but I'm really frustrated of all these >Linux activists..... >"If you often say "Do this...", then you should shut up and do it yourself." I'm not saying "Do this...", and I'm not asking you to add sound support for Linux - I'm not even asking you to add anything to the Linux version. I'm just asking you not to *break* anything. Okay? -- Stuart Brady From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 10 00:29:15 1999 Message-ID: <375EF738.780ED448@btinternet.com> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 00:22:32 +0100 From: Thomas Harte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (enough?) References: <0AEF0EB21F09D211AE4E0080C82733BF851AE6@mailhost.aculab.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1754 Lines: 36 > How come all we ever talk about these days is copyright issues? Strictly speaking that is part of the reason for GPL! The coders want the right to share source again, man. But this isn't the thread for all that. > I always thought we were developers - not lawyers. Maybe it's a new trend? > Once upon a time, when I were a lad, programmers wanted strut their stuff > to big softwares houses by writing demos. Now, it seems that people, these > days, still want to strut their stuff to the same big-guns but under a new > light: arguments over licences... But it is all so hard nowadays. If I want to show off to a software house the best I can do is to make a 3d accelerator do all its polygons at once . . . whereas the best they can do is make it do all its polygons at once! 3d accelerators (and hyped rubbish like quake) have made everything so stale now, who has the energy? Mind you - the flipside is that the way is open for a true genius to blow all the dull cobwebs away! And that person will not be known as 'Dave Perry' or his mate Zachs . . . Personally I think that a lot of the Linux components do really show off to the large software houses anyway . . . who could have predicted the sudden appearance of what idiots consider a potential MS beater from entirely unpaid labour with programs such as GIMP, Lynx and KDE? If you want to see why I personally will never 'strut my stuff' with anyone, check out my Chaos update 'Anarchy' for which I will not lower myself to promoting with a URL here. Actually, the best non-mainstream coding to have occured recently is probably the array of games for those Texas calculators once someone figured out how to break through the GUI and do some real assembly sort of stuff. -Thomas From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 10 00:49:20 1999 Message-ID: <375EFC1F.CFA70752@btinternet.com> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 00:43:27 +0100 From: Thomas Harte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 669 Lines: 19 Re: the topic - I wouldn't bother if I were you. Wish I hadn't really. > Aley seems to have left out an all-important 'yet' from the end of this > sentence, probably not intentionally. So you can see how it looks, yeah? You'll notice how 'doesn't want' is also future tense? > > A win32 Sim boycott anyone? > > Get a life Thomas... Any response to this statement which in my opinion is almost as inflamatory as 'James R Curry's brilliantly researched post would probably only look quite petty anyway. Suffice to say that if we define getting a life as not commenting on any SimCoupe GPL conversation after this one then rest assured it has been done. -Thomas From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 10 08:48:25 1999 From: "Si Owen" To: Subject: RE: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 08:45:04 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <375EFC1F.CFA70752@btinternet.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Importance: Normal X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 345 Lines: 9 Thomas Harte wrote: > So you can see how it looks, yeah? You'll notice how > 'doesn't want' is also future tense? Actually it's present tense, but that's beside the point - the point is that I didn't say it in the first place! I can understand how it might have looked, but trying to start a witch-hunt on hear-say isn't such a good idea. Si From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 10 10:41:23 1999 Message-ID: <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 21:40:21 +0100 From: Gasson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: A dumb and ill considered idea Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 2968 Lines: 69 Hello Sam users, I'm one of those people responsible for starting the recent flame war over SimCoupe, the GPL, etc. Any hoo, I was just thinking about one of the posts I read, and it gave me an idea... The biggest problem that the Sam Coupe has is the lack of new software (right?). Software developers don't want to spend time writing Sam Coupe programs, because the user base isn't big enough to net them a reasonable profit. However, there are Sam Coupe emulators for the two big hardware platforms, the Apple Macintosh and the IBM PC (right?). Now, why don't Mac and PC users buy Sam software? I can think of two good reasons -- because those platforms aren't being targeted, and because it would be a hassle for those users to install the software. Sooo... all we need is a few extensions to SimCoupe which makes it transparent to the Mac / PC user. i.e.. the Sam program is installed as per a normal Mac / PC program, and the only thing the user sees of SimCoupe is a little logo that pops up on the loading screen. Imagine this: == T'n'T A game packed with humour :-) , colour @-> , sound * , and _above_all_ ACTION! Loosely based on Bomb Jack. As well as the normal one player game, T'n'T has gone one better by giving you _TWO_ player action (...) $10 -- Available for Mac / PC and Sam. == (Damn, how do you get a pound sign in this stupid ANSI character set?) The Mac / PC user sends away for the program, and receives one installation disk. They insert the disk, double click the "install" icon (or type "install" or whatever), and hey presto, one game installed. Behind the scenes, SimCoupe looks for a previous installation of itself, installs or upgrades accordingly, copies the Sam .dsk file to an appropriate directory, creates a batch file, etc., etc. Who would buy this software? Mac or PC owners who previously had a Sam; Mac or PC owners who have friends with Sams (e.g. the readers of Format PC); and, with a bit of luck, Mac or PC owners who have friends who have friends with Sams. Who would write the software? To begin with, authors don't need to write new software, they just spend a little time designing a couple of icons, then convert one or two of their existing program to a .dsk file, copy it onto a Mac disk and a PC disk (with appropriate versions of SimCoupe), test them to make sure they work, place an ad in Format PC, and wait. If this looks promising, then they can begin to invest their effort in Sam programming again. How would SimCoupe make it self transparent? Well, the batch file that runs SimCoupe contains something like "simcoupe /autoboot tnt.dsk", SimCoupe loads, makes tnt.dsk the default disk, and does an automatic boot up. Then if a reset / reboot ever happens (as Sam programs sometimes do when "exit" is selected), SimCoupe returns to the host OS. (The most obvious technical problem I can think of with this whole idea is that not all Sam programs have this option.) Thoughts? -- James Gasson From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 10 10:56:49 1999 Message-ID: <0AEF0EB21F09D211AE4E0080C82733BF851AEB@mailhost.aculab.com> From: Justin Skists To: "'sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no'" Subject: RE: A dumb and ill considered idea Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 10:49:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 70 Lines: 10 From: James Gasson [snipped idea] >Thoughts? Interesting... Jut. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 10 18:45:30 1999 Message-ID: <002f01beb3ab$d94f8780$2fccb0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> From: "jadams1" To: Subject: td0 files Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 18:43:45 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 82 Lines: 3 How do i transfer 'tdo' files downloaded from the net unto sam disks? john adams From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 10 19:01:41 1999 Message-Id: From: Dan Doore Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 19:00:44 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no (Sam Users Mailing List) Subject: RE: td0 files MIME-version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-Mailer: TFS Secure Messaging /310000000/310102093/310102123/310460310/ X-Mailer: Version 4 Build 139 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 374 Lines: 11 > How do i transfer 'tdo' files downloaded from the net unto sam disks? You desire the evil Teledisk 2.12 for DOS, search for TELED212.ZIP on your favoured FTP search engine such as http://ftpsearch.lycos.com/ Be warned, it's been known to mis-behave on many, many machines. Dan. Work: dan@armature.com Shirk: dan@podboy.demon.co.uk VVeb: http://www.podboy.demon.co.uk/ From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 10 20:06:14 1999 Message-ID: <001101beb374$1cfd67a0$c0c448c2@Enterprise.enterprise.net> From: "Chris Pile" To: Subject: Re: td0 files Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 20:04:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 612 Lines: 19 -----Original Message----- From: Dan Doore >> How do i transfer 'tdo' files downloaded from the net unto sam disks? >You desire the evil Teledisk 2.12 for DOS, search for TELED212.ZIP on your favoured FTP search >engine such as http://ftpsearch.lycos.com/ >Be warned, it's been known to mis-behave on many, many machines. This program crashes my machine totally. However, I found that if I turn off my CPU cache it'll run fine... So, if you have trouble with Teledisk try turning your CPU cache off before running it. Most PC's allow this, just go to your BIOS set-up options. Chris. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 10 22:08:01 1999 From: davgw@clara.co.uk (Dave Whitmore) To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Based on an idea Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 21:04:16 GMT Message-ID: <3762ad60.9235747@relay.clara.net> References: <000101beb2d6$93e73060$93d4b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> In-Reply-To: <000101beb2d6$93e73060$93d4b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 302 Lines: 16 On Tue, 8 Jun 1999 20:25:24 -0700 Wed, 9 Jun 99 18:04:29 BST, "jadams1" wrote: > >Does anyone have a spare copy of the above magazine I could buy as I would >like to have a read of one. >j adams A good case of sporadic enthusiasm, if ever I saw one! Bye for now, Dave From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 10 23:42:30 1999 From: PGLOVER43@aol.com Message-ID: <9bcadc88.249197c7@aol.com> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 18:35:51 EDT Subject: Derek Morgan To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 134 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 200 Lines: 6 Does anyone know if Derek Morgan is still active on the SAM scene, or if he's joined the ranks of PC users? If nobody knows, I may have to.... (gulp) write him a letter to find out. Phil Glover. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 11 10:35:40 1999 From: Jarek Adamski To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 03:02:13 +0100 Message-ID: X-Mailer: YAM 1.3.4 - Amiga Mailer by Marcel Beck Organization: PF "NABLA" Subject: CPM22QED MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.unit.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 176 Lines: 11 Hello! If you want to test my operating systems for SAM, please write to me at 'yarek@sp7.zsk.p.lodz.pl'. To TOMBOX: Please give e-mail that does not disapear. -- Yarek. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 11 14:16:00 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: stone.dcs.warwick.ac.uk: csuan owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 14:14:16 +0100 (BST) From: Paul Walker To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: A dumb and ill considered idea In-Reply-To: <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 555 Lines: 15 On Thu, 10 Jun 1999, Gasson wrote: > Now, why don't Mac and PC users buy Sam software? I can think of two > good reasons -- because those platforms aren't being targeted, and > because it would be a hassle for those users to install the software. And also because there is far more you can *do* with a native PC game. Take, for example, Alpha Centauri, Rollercoaster Tycoon and Quake 3: Arena. Or an earlier one, such as Civ 2; Doom; Theme Park; etc. Note - the above is all IMO, if someone proves me wrong I'll be happy .. but very surprised. Paul From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 11 18:22:55 1999 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 18:18:54 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Graham Goring Subject: Re: A dumb and ill considered idea References: <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Trial Version 4.01 <8OHKkEUpoELRXEckwUjJGSM0AF> X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 844 Lines: 31 In message <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz>, Gasson writes >Imagine this: > >== > >T'n'T > >A game packed with humour :-) , colour @-> , sound * , and _above_all_ >ACTION! >Loosely based on Bomb Jack. As well as the normal one player game, T'n'T >has gone one better by giving you _TWO_ player action > >(...) > >$10 -- Available for Mac / PC and Sam. Okay, I imagined it, then I thought about the tons of PC software that's either cheaper or free, and that's far better than Matt Round's game. I don't think there's anything that's available on the SAM that hasn't been done better on the PC. (The only exception being the sublime Waterworks) Graham Goring -- /====================================\ | Ber-Limey! There's not even enough | |room to swing a cat in this sodding-| \=========== ICQ: 5333545 ===========/ From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 11 18:32:28 1999 Message-ID: <3761363A.4A228964@bonbon.net> Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 17:15:54 +0100 From: Martin Fitzpatrick X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en,en-US MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: A dumb and ill considered idea References: <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 687 Lines: 26 Gasson wrote: > Thoughts? > > -- > James Gasson Nice idea, shame about the suit.. (As someone said??..._ Yeh - it would be a good idea, and possible no doubt... But then I'm not writing it. The biggest problem would be in getting it to look like it was part of windows - e.g. on screen with the window frame & keep up the speed .... Otherwise it might be a bit unfriendly for scared users :o)... But, if thats possible (which I thinks been done in the Win32 version?) no probs :o).... Could help boost some sales I imagine... Anyhoo... it'd certainly make it more user friendly Martin Fitzpatrick -- Email: poohsticks@bonbon.net ICQ#: 11077801 AOL/CServeIM: Flupert From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 12 00:26:53 1999 Message-ID: <006601beb4a4$8bac1760$c9d4b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> From: "jadams1" To: Subject: manual Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 00:23:59 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 105 Lines: 3 Is there anyone out there can give/sell me the sam coupe manual. I aslo need printed material about Sam From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 12 13:38:49 1999 Subject: new sam OS? To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 13:33:38 +0100 (BST) In-Reply-To: <006601beb4a4$8bac1760$c9d4b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> from "jadams1" at Jun 12, 99 00:23:59 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: From: Andrew Gale X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 37 Lines: 1 A new OS for Sam? Can this be true?! From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 12 14:22:48 1999 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 14:15:23 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Stuart Brady Subject: Re: new sam OS? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Trial Version 3.05 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 219 Lines: 9 On Sat, 12 Jun 1999, Andrew Gale wrote: >A new OS for Sam? Can this be true?! Will it be Open Source? How will you run it? From the ROM or disk? I suppose I just want to see Linux for the Z80... :-) -- Stuart Brady From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 12 15:46:59 1999 From: davgw@clara.co.uk (Dave Whitmore) To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Derek Morgan Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 14:45:44 GMT Message-ID: <37615861.20653312@relay.clara.net> References: <9bcadc88.249197c7@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <9bcadc88.249197c7@aol.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 529 Lines: 20 On Thu, 10 Jun 1999 18:35:51 EDT Fri, 11 Jun 99 19:36:00 BST, PGLOVER43@aol.com wrote: >Does anyone know if Derek Morgan is still active on the SAM scene, or if he's >joined the ranks of PC users? Good question. The last time I spoke to Derek (seems like years ago) he said he /might/ get a PC someday, but he seemed to be losing interest in computers at the time. >If nobody knows, I may have to.... (gulp) write him a letter to find out. Give him a phone call. If you want his number let me know. Bye for now, Dave From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 12 19:25:38 1999 Message-ID: <007201beb543$fe1e7dc0$9fd7b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> From: "jadams1" To: Subject: Sam-the years ahead. Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 18:32:11 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 630 Lines: 10 Since rejoining this newsgroup I have been amazed how much the Sam scene has changed.Nearly all the disk/paper mags have gone including Format who's owner has disappeared. I wonder what will happen now when you want Sam repaired and where has all the software gone . Maybe its just me but I can't find any companies still supporting except David Lebury and Colin Piggot. Without support no computer can survive. I should know after owning an Atari St and various amigas over the years. All I need is someone to sell me some software I need and a printer interface.A clock would be nice as well as a second disk drive. john adams From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 12 20:49:22 1999 From: "Maria Rookyard" To: "SAM Users Mailing List" Subject: Re: Based on an idea Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 20:43:35 +0100 Message-ID: <01beb50b$dc0c1680$LocalHost@register> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by mail.comlab.ox.ac.uk id UAA00793 Status: RO Content-Length: 480 Lines: 25 Available from: Based On An Idea, 38 Squires Lane, Tyldesley, Manchester. M29 8JF Ł2 per issue (inc postage) cheques payable to M. Rookyard. Please state if you want Issue 1, 2 or both. -----Original Message----- From: jadams1 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: 09 June 1999 17:20 Subject: Based on an idea > >Does anyone have a spare copy of the above magazine I could buy as I would >like to have a read of one. >j adams > > From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 12 23:21:47 1999 Message-ID: <3762DBD6.1C06161B@btinternet.com> Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 23:14:46 +0100 From: Thomas Harte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: A dumb and ill considered idea References: <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 329 Lines: 9 [cut] > thinking about one of the posts I read, and it gave me an idea... Actually this is the one consideration that keeps me bothering to even think about writing anything for the SAM since my real machine is far too beyond useful life to make it worth it. Shame really. It is a nice little MGT machine, you know? -Thomas From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 12 23:30:57 1999 Message-ID: <3762DD6D.5302193F@btinternet.com> Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 23:21:33 +0100 From: Thomas Harte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no" Subject: Some questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1061 Lines: 27 Hi, to aid me in my continuing attempts to write some code that does something interesting, please feel free to answer the following questions : - is LDIR the fastest way to draw sprites to random positions on the screen (random in the same way as random access memory is anyway) - is LDIR the 'best' way to move sprites (bearing in mind they have a black border to rub themselves out - this is only my first z80 anything, and I don't want to aim too high), or should I be looking into RLD and RRD for incrementally moves? If so, am I still resorting to a series of LDIRs to move up and down? Ideally my sprites aren't tied to any particular direction of travel - what sort of numbers of 16x8 sprites could one be expected to achieve in this sort of system? Am I likely to be able to manage 8 or so even with my limited experience? - I seem to remember that the BASIC 'pallette at line' or whatever the command was was referred to in the manual as an on-chip capability . . . can it really be done 'automatically'? That's it for now! -Thomas From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 13 00:22:44 1999 From: PGLOVER43@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 19:16:32 EDT Subject: Re: Sam-the years ahead. To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 134 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 741 Lines: 14 SAM - the years ahead, Hmmm - I'm not too optimistic about SAM's future, but if you're after SAM spares, disk drives, etc. I'd suggest browsing the pages of MICRO COMPUTER MART, with its pages of classified ads. Occasionally you find someone selling a SAM at a knockdown price, usually with a load of software. Such a machine may be worth checking out, even if it's for cannibalised spares. Most existing SAM enthusiasts will probably hold on to any SAM hardware, even if they don't use it. Pure nostalgia gives it a value, and it would be hard to replace, and that also goes for Spectrum hardware. (Here speaks someone with over 600 vinyl LPs, dating from the days when rock bands were GOOD! -drone, bore, whinge.) Phil Glover. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 13 00:22:44 1999 Message-ID: <3762EB0D.9C95ECC3@bonbon.net> Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 00:19:41 +0100 From: Martin Fitzpatrick X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en,en-US MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Sam-the years ahead. References: <007201beb543$fe1e7dc0$9fd7b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 553 Lines: 23 jadams1 wrote: > > All I need is someone to sell > me some software I need and a printer interface.A clock would be nice as > well as a second disk drive. Well.... I've got (and willing to part with maybe... since i never really used them anyway) ..A printer interface (which works perfectly).. and a SamBus ....which I wouldn't need if I didn't have the printer interface :o) ...Lemme know... Same with anyone else.... Unused bits might as well be used.. Martin Fitzpatrick -- Email: poohsticks@bonbon.net ICQ#: 11077801 AOL/CServeIM: Flupert From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 13 01:33:40 1999 X-Sender: asc25@pop.hermes.cam.ac.uk Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3762DD6D.5302193F@btinternet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 01:29:01 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: Re: Some questions X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 3685 Lines: 94 > to aid me in my continuing attempts to write some code that does >something interesting, please feel free to answer the following >questions : > > - is LDIR the fastest way to draw sprites to random >positions on the >screen (random in the same way as random access memory is anyway) > > - is LDIR the 'best' way to move sprites (bearing in mind >they have a >black border to rub themselves out - this is only my first z80 anything, >and I don't want to aim too high), No. There are various ways to do sprites, and of course the fastest are the most complicated. I'd rather you got more confident in m/c before I try to teach you the *real* tricks of the trade[1] but there is one very simple tip which will immediately speed-bump your sprite routines by 17%: Unroll your loops. You know exactly how big your sprites are, so you know how many bytes you'll need to copy. Instead of setting BC to the correct number and doing an LDIR, which takes 24 "sam-adjusted" t-states for every byte except the last one; use the correct number of LDI instructions, which take 20 each. >or should I be looking into RLD and >RRD for incrementally moves? If you're desperate to have pixel-smooth movement horizontally, you should probably store two copies of your sprite data - the second one is shifted right by one pixel. It will be very much faster that way. Don't think about shifting the data along as you're printing it. > - what sort of numbers of 16x8 sprites could one be expected to >achieve in this sort of system? Am I likely to be able to manage 8 or so >even with my limited experience? (Assuming you mean 8 bytes wide, = 16x16 pixels) For that size sprite you'll spend 2560 t-states in LDIs, with let's say about 384 t-states total for changing the registers at the start of each line[2]. You should get 95,120 t-states per 50Hz frame, so you should manage 32 sprites that way, if you were doing nothing else. > - I seem to remember that the BASIC 'pallette at line' or >whatever the >command was was referred to in the manual as an on-chip capability . . . >can it really be done 'automatically'? Semi-automatic. There's a neat bit of hardware on the ASIC called the LINE INTerrupt register (249 Dec). The trick is to remember that, all the time while your code is running, the TV is drawing the picture in raster lines - left to right, top to bottom. Screen lines are numbered 0 to 191, down from the top of the screen. If you OUTput a screen line number to port 249, then the CPU will get an interrupt just before the raster reaches that line number. If you're quick off the mark, you can change a palette colour or two before the start of the next line gets displayed. To stop getting these interrupts, output an invalid number (ie. 192 to 255) to port 249. Maybe this would be a good time to explain the STATUS port too. As soon as you get an interrupt, you can find out what sort of interrupt is was by reading from port 259 (Dec). Bits 0-4 are normally high, but go low depending on the interrupt type: 0 Line int 1 "mouse" int - used in the COMMS interface 2 MIDI IN int 3 FRAME int (50 Hz vertical blank) 4 MIDI OUT int. Bits 5-7 are actually the top half of the keyboard matrix, for all those extra keys which the Spectrum hasn't got... HTH Andrew [1] i.e. the way I would draw a sprite myself... [2] Actually, I'd take it down to about 70, but achieving that is quite complicated again. -- | Andrew Collier | email asc25@cam.ac.uk | Talk sense to a | Part 2 NatSci | http://mnemotech.ucam.org/ | fool and he +----------------+----------------ICQ:38645805-+ calls you foolish | Selwyn College Student Computer Support Team | -- Euripides From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 13 19:01:21 1999 Message-ID: <003901beb5c6$6feb5b80$973a883e@sadsnail> From: "Tim" To: References: <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz> Subject: Re: A dumb and ill considered idea Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 08:19:50 +0100 Organization: Sad Snail Productions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 507 Lines: 9 From: Graham Goring > Okay, I imagined it, then I thought about the tons of PC software that's > either cheaper or free, and that's far better than Matt Round's game. I > don't think there's anything that's available on the SAM that hasn't > been done better on the PC. (The only exception being the sublime > Waterworks) What about EGGBuM? (admittedly it's still in the process of being written for the PC, and I might even give in to the notation it will be better...) From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 13 19:47:48 1999 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 19:43:38 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Graham Goring Subject: Re: A dumb and ill considered idea References: <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz> <003901beb5c6$6feb5b80$973a883e@sadsnail> In-Reply-To: <003901beb5c6$6feb5b80$973a883e@sadsnail> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Trial Version 4.01 <8OHKkEUpoELRXEckwUjJGSM0AF> X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 892 Lines: 23 In message <003901beb5c6$6feb5b80$973a883e@sadsnail>, Tim writes >From: Graham Goring >> Okay, I imagined it, then I thought about the tons of PC software that's >> either cheaper or free, and that's far better than Matt Round's game. I >> don't think there's anything that's available on the SAM that hasn't >> been done better on the PC. (The only exception being the sublime >> Waterworks) > >What about EGGBuM? (admittedly it's still in the process of being written >for the PC, and I might even give in to the notation it will be better...) Hmm, that's true. I ain't played anything like EGGBuM on the PC. Are you using Allegro to program it? Graham Goring -- /====================================\ | Ber-Limey! There's not even enough | |room to swing a cat in this sodding-| \=========== ICQ: 5333545 ===========/ From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 13 19:53:48 1999 Message-ID: <001501beb60f$15133ea0$f3d4b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> From: "jadams1" To: Subject: Re: Sam-the years ahead. Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 19:39:08 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 872 Lines: 34 how much for the printer interface and i will also need your address to send the money to. john -----Original Message----- From: Martin Fitzpatrick To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: Saturday, June 12, 1999 4:20 PM Subject: Re: Sam-the years ahead. > > >jadams1 wrote: >> >> All I need is someone to sell >> me some software I need and a printer interface.A clock would be nice as >> well as a second disk drive. > >Well.... I've got (and willing to part with maybe... since i never >really used them anyway) ..A printer interface (which works perfectly).. >and a SamBus ....which I wouldn't need if I didn't have the printer >interface :o) > >...Lemme know... Same with anyone else.... Unused bits might as well be >used.. > >Martin Fitzpatrick > > >-- >Email: poohsticks@bonbon.net >ICQ#: 11077801 >AOL/CServeIM: Flupert > From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 14 13:48:16 1999 Message-ID: <0AEF0EB21F09D211AE4E0080C82733BF851AF0@mailhost.aculab.com> From: Justin Skists To: "'sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no'" Subject: RE: new sam OS? Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 10:13:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 874 Lines: 26 Are you talking about Yarek's CPM22QED? What I've seen of it, it's a pretty good version of CP/M. More - umm - "standard" than Pro-DOS. ie, It's supposed to be "CP/M 2.2" rather than "CP/M 2.2 compatible" and capable of using different disk formats. There is also MIDI-Kern....but, I won't talk about that or it will never see the light of day. (Then again, I wouldn't really call it an operating system - more like an "application platform") Justin. > -----Original Message----- > From: Stuart Brady [SMTP:stuart@wholehog.demon.co.uk] > Sent: Saturday, June 12, 1999 2:15 PM > To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no > Subject: Re: new sam OS? > > On Sat, 12 Jun 1999, Andrew Gale wrote: > > >A new OS for Sam? Can this be true?! > > Will it be Open Source? How will you run it? From the ROM or disk? > > I suppose I just want to see Linux for the Z80... :-) > -- > Stuart Brady From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 15 09:11:01 1999 Message-Id: <003901beb703$b6df8780$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 09:50:18 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by mail.comlab.ox.ac.uk id JAA08393 Status: RO Content-Length: 2843 Lines: 75 ----- Original Message ----- From: Si Owen To: Sent: 9. června 1999 9:05 Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? > *takes a deep breath* > > Aley Keprt originally wrote: > > > Since Si Owen doesn't want to release his sources (I hate him for this), > > Aley seems to have left out an all-important 'yet' from the end of this > sentence, probably not intentionally. > > > Thomas Harte then wrote: > > Hey, Sim Coupe was distributed under the GPL license. If Si doesn't > > want to surrender the modified source then he is breaking the law, and > > many people within the GPL sphere are perfectly happy to help fight if > > this is the case. > > I've always said that I would release the modified source when I'm done, and > that's still what I intend to do. It's not available yet because I've not > finished my changes, and I'm not going to be pressured into releasing it > early. It'll be ready when it's ready - be patient! > > My spare time has been extremely limited recently, so I've not had a chance > to work on it. With any luck things should start to get back to 'normal' in > a few weeks time when some big work deadlines are out of the way and I'm > back from holiday. > > > > A win32 Sim boycott anyone? > > Get a life Thomas... > > Si > > I don't agree that somebody don't release source until it is finished. The SimCoupe will never be 100% finished. Or will be? I don't think so. So Si Owen probably will never release the source, since he will never be finished with his work. I think that programming a modular software (e.g. SimCoupe) means programming these modules independently. This means that when some changes are finished, they should be released. The current situation is that only one person (Si) is allowed to work on SimCoupe. e.g. Some changes in CPU emulation are made, but source is not released. Why? I'd like to work on SimCoupe too. I want to work on SOME modules, and I think I'd do it. THe current situation is not normal (see Mame project - many people work parallelly on different modules). If Si Owen don't respect this modular system (and work on several modules together), he will only make some unreadable sources with many bugs. That's not only my opinion, that's praxis of software engineering. Maybe some people think I'm sometime too scientific, but I think SimCoupe project is large enough to use the industry standard developers' technologies. And it is not so hard, especially when GPL say something, we should respect it. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 15 11:51:51 1999 Message-Id: <014d01beb71a$0b9f1400$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: Subject: Re: The continuing saga... (rapidly heading OT) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 12:30:10 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 342 Lines: 8 PLEASE STOP! I think we have enough...... ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 15 12:14:09 1999 Message-Id: <015901beb71a$ca4bf1c0$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: Subject: Re: The win32 SIM Coupe Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 12:35:29 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 999 Lines: 23 > > Please, just *DON'T* make it dependant on DOS/Windows, whatever you do. > > I know you don't care much about anything other than DOS/Windows, Aley, > > but please be careful not to ruin anything. You don't have to work on > > I don't think Aley's actually doing anything other than the sound driver. > If that becomes too dependant on Windows, then someone just writes a Unix > sound driver to take it's place. ;) Although I don't like all these Linux-activists, I can swear that I will do everything possible to maintain compatibility with any os. But - of course - currently I don't work on SimCoupe at all. I think the main problem of the original SimCoupe is the lack of documentation. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 15 12:14:09 1999 X-Sender: asc25@pop.hermes.cam.ac.uk Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <003901beb703$b6df8780$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 12:06:45 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1420 Lines: 37 At 8:50 am +0100 15/6/99, Aley Keprt wrote: >Si Owen wrote: >> I've always said that I would release the modified source when I'm done, >and >> that's still what I intend to do. It's not available yet because I've not >> finished my changes, and I'm not going to be pressured into releasing it >> early. It'll be ready when it's ready - be patient! >I don't agree that somebody don't release source until it is finished. >The SimCoupe will never be 100% finished. Or will be? I don't think so. >So Si Owen probably will never release the source, since he will never >be finished with his work. Aley, now you're just talking rubbish! Si says that as soon as the binary for SimCoupe/Win32 is released, then so will the source be. I have no reason to disbelieve him. >And it is not so hard, especially when GPL say something, we should respect >it. I just wish you lot would all shut up about the GPL. He hasn't released the binary so HE'S NOT BREAKING IT. Frankly I'm amazed you're giving him such hassle. I might have thought you'd actually be pleased that someone was taking the time and trouble to port SimCoupe to your favourite platform. Andrew -- | Andrew Collier | email asc25@cam.ac.uk | Talk sense to a | Part 2 NatSci | http://mnemotech.ucam.org/ | fool and he +----------------+----------------ICQ:38645805-+ calls you foolish | Selwyn College Student Computer Support Team | -- Euripides From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 15 12:46:39 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: scallop.dcs.warwick.ac.uk: csuan owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 12:41:53 +0100 (BST) From: Paul Walker To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: The win32 SIM Coupe In-Reply-To: <015901beb71a$ca4bf1c0$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 217 Lines: 9 On Tue, 15 Jun 1999, Aley Keprt wrote: > everything possible to maintain compatibility with any os. > But - of course - currently I don't work on SimCoupe at all. True. There's a golden lining to everything. Paul From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 15 18:44:38 1999 Message-ID: <0aTozDAbApZ3Ew7l@wholehog.demon.co.uk> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 18:40:43 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Stuart Brady Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? In-Reply-To: <003901beb703$b6df8780$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Trial Version 3.05 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 700 Lines: 15 On Tue, 15 Jun 1999, Aley Keprt wrote: >I don't agree that somebody don't release source until it is finished. >The SimCoupe will never be 100% finished. Or will be? I don't think so. >So Si Owen probably will never release the source, since he will never >be finished with his work. I think that he meant that he will release Win32 Simcoupe's source and binaries together when Win32 Simcoupe works as well as Simcoupe on DOS and Linux - that or he has a slightly different opinion of when it's ready. Ready does not mean complete/finished. I'd like to see the code released as soon as a simple (and working) port has been written - and I won't be suprised if that's what he does. -- Stuart Brady From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 15 19:01:54 1999 Message-ID: <37669366.D1093E54@btinternet.com> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 18:54:46 +0100 From: Thomas Harte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 653 Lines: 14 > Frankly I'm amazed you're giving him such hassle. I might have thought > you'd actually be pleased that someone was taking the time and trouble to > port SimCoupe to your favourite platform. Even more so since DOS compatibility is apparently 'out' as far as windows 2000 is concerned. That said, I think you'll find most GPL people wouldn't rate windows as their favourite platform! By the way (Si), for synchronisation, does SIM use some sort of timer to wait at completion of a frame before starting the next one, or does it space out its instructions as a SAM does (maybe using one of the win32 profiling counters)? Just interested. -Thomas From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 15 19:39:15 1999 Message-ID: <002401beb7a1$278b2280$95d0b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> From: "jadams1" To: Subject: Sam -year 2000-The Secretary Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 19:30:46 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 87 Lines: 3 Has anyone got a fix for the Secretary wordprocessor to make understand the year 2000 From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 16 11:19:01 1999 Message-ID: <37677960.A382089D@earthling.net> Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 10:16:00 +0000 From: Andrew Gallagher Organization: QUB X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.0.36 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? References: <37669366.D1093E54@btinternet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 996 Lines: 25 Thomas Harte wrote: > > Frankly I'm amazed you're giving him such hassle. I might have thought > > you'd actually be pleased that someone was taking the time and trouble to > > port SimCoupe to your favourite platform. > > Even more so since DOS compatibility is apparently 'out' as far as > windows 2000 is concerned. Yes and no - it depends on which version of W2K you mean. There are Win2K Server and Win2K Workstation which are just NT5 Server/Workstation rebranded and are therefore of course not DOS-compatible. There is however Win2K Personal Edition which is essentially the third instalment of Win95,Win98,... and which is backwards-compatible, presumably with DOS too. This came about because of a change of heart on the part of Microsoft, which originally wanted people to switch from Win98 to NT5 (hence the rebranding) but then relented and decided to make another straight upgrade. Confusing, eh? -- Andrew Gallagher http://members.tripod.com/~AndrewGallagher/id.html From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 17 17:49:06 1999 Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 17:47:20 +0100 (GMT) From: Robert Brady To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? In-Reply-To: <37677960.A382089D@earthling.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1333 Lines: 31 On Wed, 16 Jun 1999, Andrew Gallagher wrote: > Thomas Harte wrote: > > > > Frankly I'm amazed you're giving him such hassle. I might have thought > > > you'd actually be pleased that someone was taking the time and trouble to > > > port SimCoupe to your favourite platform. > > > > Even more so since DOS compatibility is apparently 'out' as far as > > windows 2000 is concerned. > > Yes and no - it depends on which version of W2K you mean. > > There are Win2K Server and Win2K Workstation which are just NT5 > Server/Workstation rebranded and are therefore of course not DOS-compatible. > There is however Win2K Personal Edition which is essentially the third > instalment of Win95,Win98,... and which is backwards-compatible, presumably with > DOS too. This came about because of a change of heart on the part of Microsoft, > which originally wanted people to switch from Win98 to NT5 (hence the > rebranding) but then relented and decided to make another straight upgrade. > Confusing, eh? Presumably, they are now planning to migrate everyone to NT6/Win200[2-3], or whatever. One wonders whether they will back down _again_ (for what, the 3rd time in a row?) and make the consumer version of Windows released then a DOS derivative as well... They're gonna have to break compatability at some point... -- Robert From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 17 18:04:23 1999 Message-ID: <000001beb8e3$150e53a0$9b3a883e@sadsnail> From: "Tim" To: References: <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz><003901beb5c6$6feb5b80$973a883e@sadsnail> Subject: Re: A dumb and ill considered idea Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 22:03:58 +0100 Organization: Sad Snail Productions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 327 Lines: 10 > Hmm, that's true. I ain't played anything like EGGBuM on the PC. Are you > using Allegro to program it? VB - I think - though I have a feeling he's doing a lot of the screen access directly for speed. No idea really, I just provide the odd creative input (like reminding him to make the ball a spinning beach-ball) ....@/ From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Thu Jun 17 19:17:56 1999 From: davgw@clara.co.uk (Dave Whitmore) To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Format Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 18:16:38 GMT Message-ID: <376a3b43.35939916@relay.clara.net> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 68 Lines: 4 What's the story with Format these days. Any news - anybody? Dave From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 18 09:59:39 1999 From: Jarek Adamski To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1999 04:07:37 +0100 Message-ID: X-Mailer: YAM 1.3.4 - Amiga Mailer by Marcel Beck Organization: PF "NABLA" Subject: "*.TAP" files in ZXVGS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 156 Lines: 7 Hi! The new ZXVGS 0.14 can now load into SAM "*.TAP" files of ZX Spectrum emulators. If you would like to test it, write directly to me... :-) -- Yarek. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 18 14:07:49 1999 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1999 14:01:15 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Graham Goring Subject: Re: A dumb and ill considered idea References: <376022B5.54F166C8@clear.net.nz> <003901beb5c6$6feb5b80$973a883e@sadsnail> <000001beb8e3$150e53a0$9b3a883e@sadsnail> In-Reply-To: <000001beb8e3$150e53a0$9b3a883e@sadsnail> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Trial Version 4.01 <8OHKkEUpoELRXEckwUjJGSM0AF> X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 747 Lines: 23 In message <000001beb8e3$150e53a0$9b3a883e@sadsnail>, Tim writes >> Hmm, that's true. I ain't played anything like EGGBuM on the PC. Are you >> using Allegro to program it? > >VB - I think - though I have a feeling he's doing a lot of the screen access >directly for speed. > >No idea really, I just provide the odd creative input (like reminding him to >make the ball a spinning beach-ball) as it happens, by chance I happened to recently download an extremely EGGBuM-like game called Crillion. Written using Allegro, as it happens... Graham Goring -- /====================================\ | Ber-Limey! There's not even enough | |room to swing a cat in this sodding-| \=========== ICQ: 5333545 ===========/ From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 18 21:59:49 1999 Message-ID: <003001beba10$58741c00$38d7b0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> From: "jadams1" To: Subject: Re: Format Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1999 21:50:35 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 601 Lines: 17 The last issue was dated October 1998 and that was received during March/April 1999.sine then I have sent a letter to Bob but again no reply and when you phone him there is a recorded message with up to 30 callers on it. I say its goodbye to format and maybe the end of the line for Sam as Format have all the spares as well. Maybe somebody know different. -----Original Message----- From: Dave Whitmore To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: Thursday, June 17, 1999 11:17 AM Subject: Format What's the story with Format these days. Any news - anybody? Dave From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 19 15:22:40 1999 Message-ID: <376AEBE3.6A567541@clear.net.nz> Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 02:01:23 +0100 From: James Gasson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no, Jarek Adamski Subject: Re: "*.TAP" files in ZXVGS References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 401 Lines: 13 Jarek Adamski wrote: > Hi! > > The new ZXVGS 0.14 can now load into SAM "*.TAP" files of ZX Spectrum > emulators. If you would like to test it, write directly to me... :-) Oh drat! I thought it was only my emulator which could do that on a SAM. Well then, you'd better tell me how I can get hold of a copy, so I can evaluate the competition. ;-) -- James Gasson no.spam.james.gasson@clear.net.nz From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sat Jun 19 19:21:11 1999 From: "Robert van der Veeke" To: Subject: Re: "*.TAP" files in ZXVGS Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 20:17:49 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990619181957.57FC43A9A@maillist.kabelfoon.nl> X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1051 Lines: 28 > Van: James Gasson > Aan: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no; Jarek Adamski > Onderwerp: Re: "*.TAP" files in ZXVGS > Datum: zaterdag, juni 19, 1999 3:01 > > Jarek Adamski wrote: > > Hi! > > > > The new ZXVGS 0.14 can now load into SAM "*.TAP" files of ZX Spectrum > > emulators. If you would like to test it, write directly to me... :-) > > Oh drat! I thought it was only my emulator which could do that on a SAM. > Well then, you'd better tell me how I can get hold of a copy, so I can > evaluate the competition. ;-) errr. so can the Martijn's Emulator wich supports SNA, Z80, TAP and SCR files, from MSdos or Sam disks, the Atom and even from CD-rom. And that was in version 2.4, i don't know how far he is now but he mentioned something about Kempston-support :) -- Robert van der Veeke, aka RJV Graphics [rjvveeke@caiw.nl] Currently listening to : The Phantom Menace OST Char's Gelgoog was using a double-bladed beam saber nearly 20 years before Darth Maul came down the pike! From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 20 14:31:12 1999 Message-ID: <376D8758.D108E0F0@clear.net.nz> Date: Mon, 21 Jun 1999 01:29:12 +0100 From: James Gasson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: "*.TAP" files in ZXVGS References: <19990619181957.57FC43A9A@maillist.kabelfoon.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1494 Lines: 38 Jarek Adamski wrote: > > > The new ZXVGS 0.14 can now load into SAM "*.TAP" files of ZX Spectrum > > > emulators. If you would like to test it, write directly to me... :-) James Gasson wrote: > > Oh drat! I thought it was only my emulator which could do that on a SAM. > > Well then, you'd better tell me how I can get hold of a copy, so I can > > evaluate the competition. ;-) Robert van der Veeke wrote: > errr. so can the Martijn's Emulator wich supports SNA, Z80, TAP and > SCR files, from MSdos or Sam disks, the Atom and even from CD-rom. Um, oh. *cough* Well, my emulator supports Multiface 1 tape snapshots (kind of). *mumble* *mumble* overthetop *mumble* *mumble* kitchensink *mumble* *mumble* *mumble* Ok then, I can tell this is going to be an ego destroying process for me, so you'd best put me out of my misery, and tell me where I can get a copy. CD-ROM though, now that's a clever one. I'm not even aware of a stand alone program for Sam that does that. I remember a piece in an April issue of Format (later revealed to be a joke) which mentioned using a CD-ROM on Sam. I was in 2 minds as to whether or not to believe it, partly because I didn't think it was too improbable, and also because I didn't think it was very funny. > And that was in version 2.4, i don't know how far he is now but he > mentioned something about Kempston-support :) Oh come on, now you're just being silly. That's a hardware thing. -- James Gasson no.spam.james.gasson@clear.net.nz From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 20 16:30:55 1999 Message-ID: <000201bd9c57$f80050e0$855008c3@persona> From: "David L" To: Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT Date: Sat, 20 Jun 1998 15:27:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01BD9C5F.EC84E340" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 3329 Lines: 90 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BD9C5F.EC84E340 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I've not really been posting much on the mailing list over the past few = months due to pressures at work.=20 Anyway, over the past few weeks several people have been enquiring as to = what is going on in regards to Blitz & Persona. The bottom line is - Blitz 9 was actually finished approximately 2-3 = months ago, with the final version being emailed off to Persona HQ = several times - for final checking and despatch. This also contained an excellent playable demo of an incredible game = from Chris Pile - an accurate conversion of the classic Defender game. I now realise that this could never have been recieved by the powers = that be, and despite a number of emails requesting progress - I've not = yet recieved an answer. If anyone is still awaiting any software, please direct any enquiries = directly to me: I will be chasing matters up next sunday (actually = having a day off work!) and getting something finally sorted out! Regards David ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BD9C5F.EC84E340 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I've not really been posting much on = the mailing=20 list over the past few months due to pressures at work.
 
Anyway, over the past few weeks = several people=20 have been enquiring as to what is going on in regards to Blitz &=20 Persona.
 
The bottom line is - Blitz 9 was = actually=20 finished approximately 2-3 months ago, with the final version being = emailed off=20 to Persona HQ several times - for final checking and = despatch.
 
This also contained an excellent = playable demo=20 of an incredible game from Chris Pile - an accurate conversion of the = classic=20 Defender game.
 
I now realise that this could never = have been=20 recieved by the powers that be, and despite a number of emails = requesting=20 progress - I've not yet recieved an answer.
 
If anyone is still awaiting any software, please = direct any=20 enquiries directly to me: I will be chasing matters up next sunday = (actually=20 having a day off work!) and getting something finally sorted = out!
 
Regards
 
David
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BD9C5F.EC84E340-- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 20 16:37:16 1999 Message-ID: <000e01bebb29$9bf60f00$855008c3@persona> From: "David L" To: Subject: Fw: ANNOUNCEMENT Date: Sun, 20 Jun 1999 15:31:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01BEBB31.FC9D2020" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 4027 Lines: 111 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BEBB31.FC9D2020 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable -----Original Message----- From: David L To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: 20 June 1998 15:27 Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT I've not really been posting much on the mailing list over the past few = months due to pressures at work.=20 =20 Anyway, over the past few weeks several people have been enquiring as to = what is going on in regards to Blitz & Persona. =20 The bottom line is - Blitz 9 was actually finished approximately 2-3 = months ago, with the final version being emailed off to Persona HQ = several times - for final checking and despatch. =20 This also contained an excellent playable demo of an incredible game = from Chris Pile - an accurate conversion of the classic Defender game. =20 I now realise that this could never have been recieved by the powers = that be, and despite a number of emails requesting progress - I've not = yet recieved an answer. =20 If anyone is still awaiting any software, please direct any enquiries = directly to me: I will be chasing matters up next sunday (actually = having a day off work!) and getting something finally sorted out! =20 Regards =20 David =20 ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BEBB31.FC9D2020 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
-----Original = Message-----
From:=20 David L <daveykins@theoffice.net>To:=20 sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no = <sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no>
Date:=20 20 June 1998 15:27
Subject: = ANNOUNCEMENT

I've not really been posting much on = the mailing=20 list over the past few months due to pressures at work.
 
Anyway, over the past few weeks = several people=20 have been enquiring as to what is going on in regards to Blitz &=20 Persona.
 
The bottom line is - Blitz 9 was = actually=20 finished approximately 2-3 months ago, with the final version being = emailed off=20 to Persona HQ several times - for final checking and = despatch.
 
This also contained an excellent = playable demo=20 of an incredible game from Chris Pile - an accurate conversion of the = classic=20 Defender game.
 
I now realise that this could never = have been=20 recieved by the powers that be, and despite a number of emails = requesting=20 progress - I've not yet recieved an answer.
 
If anyone is still awaiting any software, please = direct any=20 enquiries directly to me: I will be chasing matters up next sunday = (actually=20 having a day off work!) and getting something finally sorted = out!
 
Regards
 
David
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BEBB31.FC9D2020-- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 20 22:19:20 1999 Message-ID: <19990620211005.76853.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [131.107.3.72] From: Simon Cooke To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Date: Sun, 20 Jun 1999 14:10:04 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 740 Lines: 17 >From: James Gasson >CD-ROM though, now that's a clever one. I'm not even aware of a stand >alone program for Sam that does that. I remember a piece in an April >issue of Format (later revealed to be a joke) which mentioned using a >CD-ROM on Sam. I was in 2 minds as to whether or not to believe it, >partly because I didn't think it was too improbable, and also because I >didn't think it was very funny. Well, at one point I had a CD-ROM ejecting and playing audio CD's using a makeshift IDE interface... Surely someone else has played with this by now. Edwin? Simon _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Sun Jun 20 22:40:54 1999 From: "Robert van der Veeke" To: Subject: Re: Date: Sun, 20 Jun 1999 23:36:44 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990620213843.217123A9D@maillist.kabelfoon.nl> X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 945 Lines: 28 > Van: Simon Cooke > Aan: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no > Onderwerp: Re: > Datum: zondag, juni 20, 1999 11:10 > Well, at one point I had a CD-ROM ejecting and playing audio CD's using a > makeshift IDE interface... Surely someone else has played with this by now. > Edwin? Grodkowski wrote a ATAPI-driver (version v.02, extremly Alpha i guess) for the Atom that could do the same, play audio-cd's and copy files from CD rom to disk or Atom-harddisk (it works, i copied mods- and wavefiles). Based on that Martijn took the Atapi-driver and programmed it into his Spectrum-emulator so in that way you can load spectrum program's directly from CD-rom into the emulator (and yes that works also). So there. -- Robert van der Veeke, aka RJV Graphics [rjvveeke@caiw.nl] Currently listening to : The Phantom Menace OST Char's Gelgoog was using a double-bladed beam saber nearly 20 years before Darth Maul came down the pike! From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 21 00:07:23 1999 From: PGLOVER43@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 20 Jun 1999 19:05:22 EDT Subject: A newsmaking SAM owner? To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 134 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 599 Lines: 13 I've just been reading the Sunday papers, and noticed that one of the main people arrested for violence at the anti-capitalism 'Carnival' in London was called Marc Broster, from Lincolnshire. Described as a student of computer studies in The Mail on Sunday, I reckon he's the same Marc Broster who contributed programs to Sam Supplement and other disk magazines. I always found Marc to be a keen Sam user and always ready to help with program tips and ideas. Not wishing to pass comment on the pros and cons of the 'Carnival' incident, I hope Marc gets fairly treated in court. Phil Glover From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 21 01:30:02 1999 Message-ID: <00a901bebb74$a283ce20$935008c3@persona> From: "David L" To: Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT 2 Date: Mon, 21 Jun 1999 00:28:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00A6_01BEBB7D.0344CFE0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1323 Lines: 43 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00A6_01BEBB7D.0344CFE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The updated Persona Web site - as designed by the talented Gordon Wallis = - is now up at www.persona.clara.net Still a few alterations and changes to make.... mine not Gordons! David ------=_NextPart_000_00A6_01BEBB7D.0344CFE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The updated Persona Web site - as = designed by=20 the talented Gordon Wallis - is now up at www.persona.clara.net
 
Still a few alterations and changes = to make....=20 mine not Gordons!
 
David
 
------=_NextPart_000_00A6_01BEBB7D.0344CFE0-- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 21 10:05:01 1999 From: "Robert van der Veeke" To: "Sam users" Subject: About Bob Date: Mon, 21 Jun 1999 11:01:32 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990621090353.AB84A3A9E@maillist.kabelfoon.nl> X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.unit.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 717 Lines: 18 I know that he has been seriously ill but one thing still bothers me. After months and months it appears that it is still a huge problem for Bob to send out a single message by himself or by someone close to him (Bill Bossy?) stating what has happend and how long it will take before things are normal again. People are getting worried, pissed etc. looking at messages at CCS. So a sort of official message would help much to clear this foggy situation. -- Robert van der Veeke, aka RJV Graphics [rjvveeke@caiw.nl] Currently listening to : The Phantom Menace OST Char's Gelgoog was using a double-bladed beam saber nearly 20 years before Darth Maul came down the pike! BTW: Is Bill actually still at the list? From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 21 11:47:59 1999 From: Jarek Adamski To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: Mon, 21 Jun 1999 12:23:02 +0100 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <376AEBE3.6A567541@clear.net.nz> X-Mailer: YAM 1.3.4 - Amiga Mailer by Marcel Beck Organization: PF "NABLA" Subject: Re: "*.TAP" files in ZXVGS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 2335 Lines: 86 Hi! Dnia 99-06-19 James Gasson pisze: > Well then, you'd better tell me how I can get hold of a copy, > so I can evaluate the competition. ;-) Wow! At once the competition. I only was looking for users for my software... :-) Never mind... To get working ZXVGS on SAM through Internet is a bit complicated procedure because of the only one filesystem implemented now in ZXVGS is CP/M 2.2 one. :-( So you will need: - about 300KB "CPM22QED.LHA" uuencoded file that I will send; - uudecode program; - unlha program; - 3.5" floppy disk formatted to 72KB in MS-DOS; - second 3.5" floppy disk for CP/M installation; - "ZXVGS.guide" file; - AmigaGuide program to read it comfortably (or WINGUIDE.EXE). Mentioned "ZXVGS.guide" should be in "VGSguide.lha" on: http://nautilus.uwoj.krakow.pl/zxland/ Otherwise ask "tadek@nautilus.uwoj.krakow.pl" how to get my files. The procedure is: 1. Uudecode file "CPM22QED.LHA". 2. Unlha it. 3. Copy file "CPM22QED.106" to empty 720KB MS-DOS disk. 4. Boot SAM from it using e.g. . 5. CPM22QED will copy all files to ramdisk. 6. Insert new disk (not necessary). ;-) 7. Format it to 820KB using: QFORMAT 0:DISKNAME /QED820 8. Copy all files to this disk using: PPIP A:*.* B: 9. Make the disk bootable using: SYS22QED B: 10. Reset SAM. You can use: RESET 11. Boot SAM from the 820KB disk. In case of troubles write to me. :-) On the disk there will be ZXVGS 0.13 that doesn't load "*.TAP"... :-) The file "VGSSAM.COM". Then I'll send soon short archive with new "VGSSAM.COM" and "R-MSDOS.COM". The R-MSDOS program reads files from 720KB MS-DOS disks and copies them to M: (ramdisk). You should PPIP them to A: (floppy disk) before use. This way you will be able to load new ZXVGS version and new R-MSDOS program that allows load "*.TAP" files from MS-DOS. The current R-MSDOS will not save "end marker" with "*.TAP" file, what is required in CP/M filesystem. > ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- > > (expanded from: ) > ----- Transcript of session follows ----- > mail.local: unknown name: no.spam.james.gasson > 550 ... User unknown And tell me where to I could send uuencoded "CPM22QED.LHA" file. -- Yarek. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 22 21:27:05 1999 Message-ID: <000d01bebd2f$c0604600$2fcbb0c2@aahomepc.unibol.com> From: "jadams1" To: Subject: unsubscribe Date: Tue, 22 Jun 1999 20:19:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 2633 Lines: 95 unsubscribe -----Original Message----- From: Jarek Adamski To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: Monday, June 21, 1999 3:47 AM Subject: Re: "*.TAP" files in ZXVGS >Hi! > >Dnia 99-06-19 James Gasson pisze: > >> Well then, you'd better tell me how I can get hold of a copy, >> so I can evaluate the competition. ;-) >Wow! At once the competition. I only was looking for users for >my software... :-) Never mind... > >To get working ZXVGS on SAM through Internet is a bit >complicated procedure because of the only one filesystem >implemented now in ZXVGS is CP/M 2.2 one. :-( > >So you will need: > - about 300KB "CPM22QED.LHA" uuencoded file that I will send; > - uudecode program; > - unlha program; > - 3.5" floppy disk formatted to 72KB in MS-DOS; > - second 3.5" floppy disk for CP/M installation; > - "ZXVGS.guide" file; > - AmigaGuide program to read it comfortably (or WINGUIDE.EXE). > > >Mentioned "ZXVGS.guide" should be in "VGSguide.lha" on: > >http://nautilus.uwoj.krakow.pl/zxland/ > >Otherwise ask "tadek@nautilus.uwoj.krakow.pl" how to get my >files. > > >The procedure is: > 1. Uudecode file "CPM22QED.LHA". > 2. Unlha it. > 3. Copy file "CPM22QED.106" to empty 720KB MS-DOS disk. > 4. Boot SAM from it using e.g. . > 5. CPM22QED will copy all files to ramdisk. > 6. Insert new disk (not necessary). ;-) > 7. Format it to 820KB using: > >QFORMAT 0:DISKNAME /QED820 > > 8. Copy all files to this disk using: > >PPIP A:*.* B: > > 9. Make the disk bootable using: > >SYS22QED B: > > 10. Reset SAM. You can use: > >RESET > > 11. Boot SAM from the 820KB disk. > >In case of troubles write to me. :-) > > >On the disk there will be ZXVGS 0.13 that doesn't load >"*.TAP"... :-) The file "VGSSAM.COM". > >Then I'll send soon short archive with new "VGSSAM.COM" and >"R-MSDOS.COM". > >The R-MSDOS program reads files from 720KB MS-DOS disks and >copies them to M: (ramdisk). You should PPIP them to A: (floppy >disk) before use. This way you will be able to load new ZXVGS >version and new R-MSDOS program that allows load "*.TAP" files >from MS-DOS. The current R-MSDOS will not save "end marker" with >"*.TAP" file, what is required in CP/M filesystem. > > > >> ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- >> >> (expanded from: ) > >> ----- Transcript of session follows ----- >> mail.local: unknown name: no.spam.james.gasson >> 550 ... User unknown >And tell me where to I could send uuencoded "CPM22QED.LHA" file. > > >-- >Yarek. > From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 22 21:47:49 1999 Message-ID: <007b01bebce6$27516be0$8b5008c3@persona> From: "David L" To: Subject: Re: unsubscribe Date: Tue, 22 Jun 1999 20:33:48 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 306 Lines: 17 -----Original Message----- From: jadams1 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: 22 June 1999 21:29 Subject: unsubscribe >Thanks for using NetForward! >http://www.netforward.com >v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v > >unsubscribe Why? From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 23 08:00:42 1999 Message-Id: <009301bebd43$68ed6740$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: Subject: Win2000 (was: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight?) Date: Wed, 23 Jun 1999 08:41:23 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by mail.comlab.ox.ac.uk id IAA17201 Status: RO Content-Length: 2352 Lines: 66 ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert Brady To: Sent: 17. června 1999 18:47 Subject: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight? > On Wed, 16 Jun 1999, Andrew Gallagher wrote: > > > Thomas Harte wrote: > > > > > > Frankly I'm amazed you're giving him such hassle. I might have thought > > > > you'd actually be pleased that someone was taking the time and trouble to > > > > port SimCoupe to your favourite platform. > > > > > > Even more so since DOS compatibility is apparently 'out' as far as > > > windows 2000 is concerned. > > > > Yes and no - it depends on which version of W2K you mean. > > > > There are Win2K Server and Win2K Workstation which are just NT5 > > Server/Workstation rebranded and are therefore of course not DOS-compatible. > > There is however Win2K Personal Edition which is essentially the third > > instalment of Win95,Win98,... and which is backwards-compatible, presumably with > > DOS too. This came about because of a change of heart on the part of Microsoft, > > which originally wanted people to switch from Win98 to NT5 (hence the > > rebranding) but then relented and decided to make another straight upgrade. > > Confusing, eh? > > Presumably, they are now planning to migrate everyone to NT6/Win200[2-3], > or whatever. One wonders whether they will back down _again_ (for what, > the 3rd time in a row?) and make the consumer version of Windows released > then a DOS derivative as well... > > They're gonna have to break compatability at some point... > > -- > Robert > > The question is why NT cannot suport "more" DOS? I think it could - when my SB Live! can emulate SB16 using software driver, NT would emulate SB16 too (on any soundcard), as well as most other hardware points of DOS programs to became at least as good as Win95 DOS box is. This wouldn't be 100%, but it would be 99% (or 98), especially when most of the current software is written in DJGPP, which seems to be well designed to be run under Windows. That's only my opinion. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 23 08:05:29 1999 Message-Id: <00ab01bebd43$ad79c610$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: <19990620213843.217123A9D@maillist.kabelfoon.nl> Subject: Re: Date: Wed, 23 Jun 1999 08:43:17 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by mail.comlab.ox.ac.uk id IAA17211 Status: RO Content-Length: 1238 Lines: 39 ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert van der Veeke To: Sent: 20. června 1999 23:36 Subject: Re: > > Van: Simon Cooke > > Aan: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no > > Onderwerp: Re: > > Datum: zondag, juni 20, 1999 11:10 > > > Well, at one point I had a CD-ROM ejecting and playing audio CD's using a > > > makeshift IDE interface... Surely someone else has played with this by > now. > > Edwin? > > Grodkowski wrote a ATAPI-driver (version v.02, extremly Alpha i guess) for > the Atom that could do the same, play audio-cd's and copy files from CD rom > to disk or Atom-harddisk (it works, i copied mods- and wavefiles). > > Based on that Martijn took the Atapi-driver and programmed it into his > Spectrum-emulator so in that way you can load spectrum program's directly > from CD-rom into the emulator (and yes that works also). > > So there. ...great and funny, isn't it? ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 23 08:11:18 1999 Message-Id: <00d501bebd44$e0c00920$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: "Sam Users" Subject: TAP on Sam Coupe Date: Wed, 23 Jun 1999 08:51:53 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 1022 Lines: 30 There are probably more emulators that support TAP files, especially when TAP is the standard. One of them is my "TAP Emulator" for Sam made in spring 1995. It was a question of 1 hour. I've made also automatic tape-to-TAP cenverter which makes standard TAP files. I didn't mentioned this since I though that Sam people are no more interested in emulating Spectrum (since they are just emulating Sam on PC :) If somebody wish, I can discuss the folowing topics: emulating: 1. zx printer or just a printer 2. whole sam keyboard 3. automatic tape-to-TAP converter 4. tape-on-disk (incl. multiload games) 5. ZXS 128 (AY-3-8910) music 6. ZXS 128 7. making and using SNA, Z80 and other snap files maybe something more... ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From imc@comlab.ox.ac.uk Wed Jun 23 10:13:16 1999 Date: Wed, 23 Jun 1999 10:13:16 +0100 From: Ian Collier To: Sam Users Subject: Re: TAP on Sam Coupe Message-ID: <19990623101316.A29578@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mail-Followup-To: Sam Users References: <00d501bebd44$e0c00920$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <00d501bebd44$e0c00920$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz>; from Aley Keprt on Wed, Jun 23, 1999 at 08:51:53AM +0200 Status: RO Content-Length: 147 Lines: 6 On Wed, Jun 23, 1999 at 08:51:53AM +0200, Aley Keprt wrote: > 2. whole sam keyboard Ah. I already have a speccy ROM which will do this. :-) imc From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 23 10:27:48 1999 Message-Id: From: Dan Doore Date: Wed, 23 Jun 1999 10:26:30 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no (Sam Users Mailing List) Subject: RE: unsubscribe MIME-version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-Mailer: TFS Secure Messaging /310000000/310102093/310102123/310460310/ X-Mailer: Version 4.5 Build 203 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 233 Lines: 15 > unsubscribe http://www.podboy.demon.co.uk/coupe/maillist.htm or: If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, send the following command in email to : unsubscribe HTH. Dan. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 23 11:55:30 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: stone.dcs.warwick.ac.uk: csuan owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 23 Jun 1999 11:53:53 +0100 (BST) From: Paul Walker To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Win2000 (was: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight?) In-Reply-To: <009301bebd43$68ed6740$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 372 Lines: 13 On Wed, 23 Jun 1999, Aley Keprt wrote: > This wouldn't be 100%, but it would be 99% (or 98), especially when most of > the current software is written in DJGPP, which seems to be well designed to > be run under Windows. Very few apps out there are written using DJGPP; they normally use Borland or Microsoft compilers. As for *why*, that's another matter... :-) Paul From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 25 14:25:25 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: whelk.dcs.warwick.ac.uk: csuan owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 14:21:05 +0100 (BST) From: Paul Walker To: fsf-list@onelist.com cc: blush-peck@drmach.demon.co.uk, sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Degree Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.unit.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 104 Lines: 7 Woo! I got a 2:1! Excuse me, but I'm going to be a little incoherent for the rest of the day... Paul From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 25 15:53:00 1999 Message-Id: <001501bebf1a$16be2e90$7251c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: Subject: Re: Win2000 (was: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight?) Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 16:50:38 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by mail.comlab.ox.ac.uk id PAA00996 Status: RO Content-Length: 1300 Lines: 40 ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Walker To: Sent: 23. června 1999 12:53 Subject: Re: Win2000 (was: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight?) > On Wed, 23 Jun 1999, Aley Keprt wrote: > > > This wouldn't be 100%, but it would be 99% (or 98), especially when most of > > the current software is written in DJGPP, which seems to be well designed to > > be run under Windows. > > Very few apps out there are written using DJGPP; they normally use Borland > or Microsoft compilers. > > As for *why*, that's another matter... :-) > > Paul did you asleep? most of the new DOS applications are made in DJGPP, that's the fact! I haven't seen any *REAL* application written in something other than DJGPP for a while. btw. SimCoupe is compiled in DJGPP too. And that's what we should talk about, we samusers :))) btw. That's the question: Does SimCoupe for DOS work on NT 4.0? One person announced, that v0.781a works, but 0.782a doesn't. ????? ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 25 16:19:33 1999 Message-Id: <001d01bebf1b$c2ea26a0$7251c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: References: <00d501bebd44$e0c00920$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> <19990623101316.A29578@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Subject: Speccy (TAP) on Sam Coupe, Prince Of Persia Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 17:02:36 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by mail.comlab.ox.ac.uk id QAA01479 Status: RO Content-Length: 1782 Lines: 48 ----- Original Message ----- From: Ian Collier To: Sam Users Sent: 23. června 1999 11:13 Subject: Re: TAP on Sam Coupe > On Wed, Jun 23, 1999 at 08:51:53AM +0200, Aley Keprt wrote: > > 2. whole sam keyboard > > Ah. I already have a speccy ROM which will do this. :-) > > imc How "already"? All my work on Speccy emulation was made in 1992-93. I haven't said it is something new. I must add that Speccy emulation on Sam was much better in former east-block countries, since there were much more "free" Speccy games available there, and there were no real copyright on original Speccy ROM. So "we" did much better emulators in 1990-1993. I don't know much what happened in 1994 and later, since my Sam period ended 1993. I still have over 10 samdisks filled with ZXS128k games converted to Sam. If somebody wants, I *possibly* can upload this stuff to NVG (??? hope it is legal now in 1999 ???). Most of games I've already deleted (they doesn't look as well compared with my current Voodoo Banshee games :))). As far as I can remember: Myth, Lemmings, Operation Wolf, Dragon Spirit, R-Type, Rambo III, Turtles II, Exolon, Tetris 2, Rex, Loopz, Hero Quest I+II, Terminator II, Robocop II, Sim City, etc. I also remember F-19 Stealth and Turrican II, but these ones seem to be lost. ----- Also, Michal Wolf announced, that he has Prince of Persia working in SimCoupe 0.781a, after some tricks. Great news for great game! ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 25 16:19:36 1999 Message-Id: <003901bebf1c$3a5dfc20$7251c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: "Sam Users" Subject: Enigma Variations Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 17:05:57 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 565 Lines: 12 Can anybody explain, what is (was) Enigma Variations, why and how did they made so many nice games for Sam, why they all are from 1990, and why they didn't continue producing Sam games? (I've seen Turrican II by Enigma on ZXS shortly after they end work on Sam). ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 25 16:39:51 1999 Message-ID: <001901bebf1e$a3f02120$42111111@spangly.team17.com.> From: "Guy Palmer" To: Subject: Sam Coupe Hardware Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 16:23:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 153 Lines: 5 Does anyone know anyone or anywhere that might be selling a Sam Coupe? I desperately wanna get my hands on one so any help would be much appreciated.. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 25 17:12:05 1999 Message-ID: <003701bebf24$2d6e8c20$410bf0d4@chris> From: "The President" To: References: <003901bebf1c$3a5dfc20$7251c29e@inf.upol.cz> Subject: Re: Enigma Variations Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 17:02:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1098 Lines: 33 All of the peeps @ Enigma where self employed , and they all went on to setup there own companys ( Twilight & Hookstone where 2 off em ) , the rest still work in the industry ( Climax , Rtd , Rare , Bitmap Brother's and Ea are the ones i know of) The bod who ran the offices ( MArk Green I think ) , is currently hiding from mr Vat man Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Aley Keprt To: Sam Users Sent: 25 June 1999 16:05 Subject: Enigma Variations > Can anybody explain, what is (was) Enigma Variations, why and how did they > made so many nice games for Sam, why they all are from 1990, and why they > didn't continue producing Sam games? > > (I've seen Turrican II by Enigma on ZXS shortly after they end work on Sam). > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) > phone: +420-68-538 70 35 > e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > > > From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 25 18:45:17 1999 Message-ID: <3773BD5C.7F34CC2E@btinternet.com> Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 18:33:16 +0100 From: Thomas Harte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en,en-* MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Speccy (TAP) on Sam Coupe, Prince Of Persia References: <00d501bebd44$e0c00920$6951c29e@inf.upol.cz> <19990623101316.A29578@comlab.ox.ac.uk> <001d01bebf1b$c2ea26a0$7251c29e@inf.upol.cz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 473 Lines: 11 > As far as I can remember: Myth, Lemmings, Operation Wolf, Dragon Spirit, > R-Type, Rambo III, Turtles II, Exolon, Tetris 2, Rex, Loopz, Hero Quest > I+II, Terminator II, Robocop II, Sim City, etc. Just been checking against WoS, and they at least seem happy to distribute all of those except Lemmings, which has been expressely forbade by Psygnosis. So take anything about legality you can from that. On my SAM I also had Chase HQ I seem to remember . . . -Thomas From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 25 19:18:06 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: stone.dcs.warwick.ac.uk: csuan owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 19:13:42 +0100 (BST) From: Paul Walker To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Win2000 (was: Re: Linux vs. Win32 SimCoupe - must I fight?) In-Reply-To: <001501bebf1a$16be2e90$7251c29e@inf.upol.cz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 409 Lines: 11 On Fri, 25 Jun 1999, Aley Keprt wrote: > most of the new DOS applications are made in DJGPP, that's the fact! > I haven't seen any *REAL* application written in something other than DJGPP Aley, I really cannot be fscked to argue with you. I do not know of any *real* application written in DJGPP apart from Quake, but if you want to maintain they all are, then that's your problem. Have a nice life. Paul From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Fri Jun 25 21:04:36 1999 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 20:57:16 +0100 Cc: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Dave Subject: Re: Degree References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 To: unlisted-recipients:; (no To-header on input) X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 183 Lines: 11 Paul Walker writes >Woo! I got a 2:1! > >Excuse me, but I'm going to be a little incoherent for the rest of the >day... first ... -- Dave From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 28 11:05:46 1999 Message-ID: <2164EF067AC1D011BEDE0040052FA539A88449@exchange.climax.co.uk> From: Rob Holman To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: RE: Enigma Variations Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 11:06:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1468 Lines: 36 All of the peeps @ Enigma where self employed , and they all went on to setup there own companys ( Twilight & Hookstone where 2 off em ) , the rest still work in the industry ( Climax , Rtd , Rare , Bitmap Brother's and Ea are the ones i know of) The bod who ran the offices ( MArk Green I think ) , is currently hiding from mr Vat man ..some of the ex-enigma peeps are at psygnosis now as well. Mark G did go and live in france for a while to avoid the tax-man (working for some games company or other) ..but i think he returned to the uk and now runs another company called G3 enigma stopped doing sam games when it stopped making money. When the first games cames out, everyone bought them, as there was not much software around for the sam. After a while, sales dropped to around 500 copies a title which enigma decided was'nt enough to cover costs (funny that coz i was writing them being paid something like 50p an hour ! ;o) To be honest, enigma did rip-people off, (the sam club etc) i can remember being pushed to finish sphera off for some computer show or another, there was no way of doing it so they told me to make it crash in a certain part, so they could release it (sell it) and then i could finish the game off, and they would release it as a patch later on....very, very dodgy, but that was how enigma operated (tip to any new coders : never work for small dodgy companies, coz this shit still goes on now....i'm 10yrs wiser now....) rob :o) From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 28 14:58:21 1999 Message-Id: <007101bec16b$28802220$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: "Sam Users" Subject: New: SimCoupe 0.783a Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 15:35:59 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 798 Lines: 22 Si Owen still haven't released anything, so here is anothrer DOS version. new/updated: 1. CloseSound @ exit 2. save screen snapshot Sam-snapshot (whole memory+cpu+audio & video state) is planned, but haven't realised yet, since we must discuss the fileformat at first. (I don't want to make my own standards as Si does.) Maybe we could use something like Z80 fileformat used on ZXS (it has internal compression - very necessary for Sam). You can download SimCoupe 0.783a at http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 28 15:18:09 1999 Message-Id: <008001bec16e$0c87eaf0$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: "Sam Users" Subject: Enigma Variations II. Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 15:56:41 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 2159 Lines: 71 Big thanks to Rob Holman and Chris White (The President) for info on Enigma. I must say that all games by Enigma have got nice graphics and good music. But I can't find any playability there. Maybe that's the reason why people didn't bought new games from Enigma (probably not the main reason, but who knows...) ----- note: Go to http://get.to/hcc and see arcade game tournaments (there are Sam games too) ----- Look at details: --------- Defenders - graphics reasonable, music only 3 channel mono (why?), playability none Escape - graphics: silly in menu (ZXS pictures), o.k. in game, music very simple, but reasonable, playability: good for a little time, then boring, since it is still the same again and again Future Ball - graphics reasonable, music good, playability none Sphera - graphics: good, music: good, but extremely short, playability: very low, since you only fly, fly, and fly, and nothing else (something like Escape) Pipe Mania - no problems, this game is great (I'm not sure, whether this is Enigma one or not.) Sam Out - nice graphics & music, no playability (extremely stupid one!) Five - primitive game engine, no music (I don'k know much about the scenario.) forgotten someone? Now let's look to some games from different companies: ------------ Splat - resonable graphics, great music, high playability Manic Miner - nice graphics & music, good playability (only if you like to play a game from 1983) Klax - simply great Shanghai (work of a few days): simply great Hexagonia - weird graphics & sound, great music, good playability Tetris - simply great Tweety - great graphics & music, no playability (it's a demo?) Snake Mania & Craft - simply great Prince Of Persia - great, but the playability is a bit worse etc. So, Enigma did a *nice* games, but forgot the playability. I'm affraid this is a BIG problem. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 28 15:30:52 1999 Message-Id: <008601bec16e$ccf16cd0$6b51c29e@inf.upol.cz> From: "Aley Keprt" To: "Sam Users" Subject: Searching for screen converter Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 16:02:03 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 756 Lines: 19 I'm searching for a simple screen converter, which can convert Sam MODE 4 screenshots I've made in some games to a legal PC format (GIF,BMP). I don't need this stuff for Sam, since I have my pictures on a PC (made using SimCoupe). I have one "converter" already, but it is stupid - I view a picture in samview, then make a screen snapshot (in Win98), then conpy image from clipboard to a file (this makes 640x480/16m pictures from Sam's MODE 4!!!) :-) ---------------------------------------------------------------- Aley [eili] Keprt - student, programmer (multimedia soft. etc.) phone: +420-68-538 70 35 e-mail: AleyKeprt@bigfoot.com *** http://get.to/aley ---------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 28 15:34:07 1999 Message-ID: <2164EF067AC1D011BEDE0040052FA539A885D0@exchange.climax.co.uk> From: Rob Holman To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: RE: Enigma Variations II. Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 15:35:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1437 Lines: 43 Look at details: --------- Defenders - graphics reasonable, ..actually, i thought the graphics in defenders were some of the best ever seen on the sam, and don't forget when we did defenders there was not one single game out ! music only 3 channel mono (why?), ..you've had the sam now for 8 years, we'd had it for a week when we started defenders, i think the music driver was knocked up over a weekend with almost no documentation by a guy called sean conran! ..it's a miracle it had any sound at all ! ;o) (i wonder what he's upto these dayz....) playability none can't argue with that ! ;o) ..really there was no time, it was just a matter of get it out the door as quick as possible, we had lousy bosses and that's how we had to work. The thing with coding is that the playability part is the last bit that gets tweaked after all the technical stuff is done, some bosses just look at the screen, go 'that's pretty' and think it's done (coz they never play stuff themselves) fortunately things are better now (get the time i need) ..i could still do with longer, but it's not as bad as it used to be ! ..still it years ago, so it's very much in the past now (only joined this group a few days ago, i was just surfing, and for a laugh i thought i'd see if there was anything on the sam. To be honest i'm surprised anyone still remembers it so i thought i'd join for a while to see what's happening in sam land ! ) rob :o) From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 28 19:29:21 1999 From: PGLOVER43@aol.com Message-ID: <262f30f9.24a91832@aol.com> Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 14:25:54 EDT Subject: Re: Searching for screen converter To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 134 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 520 Lines: 10 I believe there was a Sam screen converter in an old issue of SAM Supplement. The program formatted a SAM disk to a sort-of PC format, which allowed you to save about a dozen SAM screenshots to it in a PC format (.BMP or .JPG?) I can't remember which issue it was, or how it worked, but I managed to convert about thirty SAM mode 4 screens, which must indicate it was very easy to use! Anyone remember this program? If I come across it, I'll let everyone know, as it was a very good little utility. Phil Glover. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 28 22:16:24 1999 X-Sender: asc25@pop3.house Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <2164EF067AC1D011BEDE0040052FA539A88449@exchange.climax.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 18:11:44 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: RE: Enigma Variations X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 418 Lines: 18 At 11:09 am +0100 28/6/99, Rob Holman wrote: >rob :o) Woah! The one and only Rob Holman! We are not worthy! We are not worthy! So how long have you been around sam-users then? Andrew -- -- Andrew Collier (asc25@cam.ac.uk) -- My other -- http://mnemotech.ucam.org -- .sig is a -- Part 3 Materials Science, Cambridge -- PDF file -- From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Mon Jun 28 22:38:44 1999 From: "Robert van der Veeke" To: Subject: Re: Searching for screen converter Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 23:31:19 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990628213315.F1E483A9E@maillist.kabelfoon.nl> X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 747 Lines: 22 > Van: PGLOVER43@aol.com > Aan: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no > Onderwerp: Re: Searching for screen converter > Datum: maandag, juni 28, 1999 8:25 > Anyone remember this program? If I come across it, I'll let everyone know, as > it was a very good little utility. I do remember two that two programs called BMP2SCR and SCR2BMP where on a Fred-disk, they work quite well except for a small bug when your BMP has less than 16 colors. I use those programs quite often :) And there was a IFF to SCR proggie i believe. -- Robert van der Veeke, aka RJV Graphics [rjvveeke@caiw.nl] Currently listening to : Rurouni Kenshin - Brilliant collection - Char's Gelgoog was using a double-bladed beam saber nearly 20 years before Darth Maul came down the pike! From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 29 03:37:03 1999 Message-Id: <199906290233.WAA18409@msuacad.morehead-st.edu> From: "James R Curry" To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 22:39:28 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: RE: Enigma Variations In-reply-to: References: <2164EF067AC1D011BEDE0040052FA539A88449@exchange.climax.co.uk> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v3.01d) X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 599 Lines: 18 Date sent: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 18:11:44 +0100 To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no From: Andrew Collier Subject: RE: Enigma Variations Send reply to: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no > -- > -- Andrew Collier (asc25@cam.ac.uk) -- My other > -- http://mnemotech.ucam.org -- .sig is a > -- Part 3 Materials Science, Cambridge -- PDF file ^^^^ ROFL!! -- James R Curry - James@curry.com "The Balloon Doggies DEMANDED it!" From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 29 08:44:29 1999 From: Gouranga@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 03:42:03 EDT Subject: RE: Enigma Variations To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL NetMail version 2.0 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 1652 Lines: 42 Mark Greenshields is currently up here in bonny Scotland, as a director of "Steel Monkeys". Apparently. C. > All of the peeps @ Enigma where self employed , and they all went on to > setup there own companys ( Twilight & Hookstone where 2 off em ) , the rest > still work in the industry ( Climax , Rtd , Rare , Bitmap Brother's and Ea > are the ones i know of) > > The bod who ran the offices ( MArk Green I think ) , is currently hiding > from mr Vat man > > .some of the ex-enigma peeps are at psygnosis now as well. Mark G did go > and live in france for > a while to avoid the tax-man (working for some games company or other) ..but > i think he returned > to the uk and now runs another company called G3 > > enigma stopped doing sam games when it stopped making money. When the first > games cames > out, everyone bought them, as there was not much software around for the > sam. After a while, > sales dropped to around 500 copies a title which enigma decided was'nt > enough to > cover costs (funny that coz i was writing them being paid something like 50p > an hour ! ;o) > > To be honest, enigma did rip-people off, (the sam club etc) i can remember > being pushed to finish > sphera off for some computer show or another, there was no way of doing it > so they told me to make it > crash in a certain part, so they could release it (sell it) and then i could > finish the game off, > and they would release it as a patch later on....very, very dodgy, but that > was how enigma > operated (tip to any new coders : never work for small dodgy companies, coz > this shit > still goes on now....i'm 10yrs wiser now....) > > rob :o) > From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 29 11:04:58 1999 Message-ID: <2164EF067AC1D011BEDE0040052FA539A88753@exchange.climax.co.uk> From: Rob Holman To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: RE: Enigma Variations Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 11:06:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 913 Lines: 24 So how long have you been around sam-users then? just the last 4 days ! :o) ...did a search for sam things in a moment of boredom the other day, and was surprised to find an active list ! I didn't think anyone would remember the sam, let alone be writing emulators and stuff for it ! :o) ..i've been in 3d Playstation/PC land for the last 4 years working at Team 17 on a mario-esque platform game called P.i.G, but have recently relocated to the south (for a whole load of reasons.....) to work for Climax. I've just finished a realtime I.K. system with Skinning for PSX and i'm now spending a month or two chilling out, finishing off a Gameboy project as a favour for someone ! (i think that's why i was looking at sam stuff having suddenly being thrust back into z80 land, which is something i've not used for years and years, takes a while to get back into after lots of hardware and 'C' !) rob :o) From imc@comlab.ox.ac.uk Tue Jun 29 11:07:30 1999 Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 11:08:09 +0100 From: Ian Collier To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Enigma Variations Message-ID: <19990629110809.F13351@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mail-Followup-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no References: <2164EF067AC1D011BEDE0040052FA539A88449@exchange.climax.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Andrew Collier on Mon, Jun 28, 1999 at 06:11:44PM +0100 Status: RO Content-Length: 336 Lines: 11 On Mon, Jun 28, 1999 at 06:11:44PM +0100, Andrew Collier wrote: > -- ^ missing space, if I'm not mistaken. > My other > .sig is a > PDF file I don't believe you. Prove it... imc From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 29 13:31:00 1999 Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 13:28:02 +0100 (BST) From: Andrew Collier X-Sender: asc25@red.csi.cam.ac.uk To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Enigma Variations In-Reply-To: <19990629110809.F13351@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 813 Lines: 24 On Tue, 29 Jun 1999, Ian Collier wrote: > On Mon, Jun 28, 1999 at 06:11:44PM +0100, Andrew Collier wrote: > > -- > ^ missing space, if I'm not mistaken. So there is. Hmm, that's bizarre. I'm sure it's in there this time... > > My other > > .sig is a > > PDF file > > I don't believe you. Prove it... It was a joke, Ian. Something like "My other car is a Mercedes" or "My other car-sticker is funny" or something.... Andrew -- -- Andrew Collier (asc25@cam.ac.uk) -- My other -- http://mnemotech.ucam.org -- .sig is a -- Part 3 Materials Science, Cambridge -- PDF file -- From imc@comlab.ox.ac.uk Tue Jun 29 14:02:22 1999 Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 14:02:22 +0100 From: Ian Collier To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Subject: Re: Enigma Variations Message-ID: <19990629140221.I13351@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mail-Followup-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no References: <19990629110809.F13351@comlab.ox.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Andrew Collier on Tue, Jun 29, 1999 at 01:28:02PM +0100 Status: RO Content-Length: 209 Lines: 10 On Tue, Jun 29, 1999 at 01:28:02PM +0100, Andrew Collier wrote: > So there is. Hmm, that's bizarre. I'm sure it's in there this time... It appears to be. > It was a joke, Ian. Yes. As was my comment. imc From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Jun 29 18:38:58 1999 From: PGLOVER43@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 13:34:57 EDT Subject: Re: Enigma Variations To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 134 X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 227 Lines: 7 Just a quick message to say I have several Enigma Games, and very good they are too. The programmers deserve a lot of credit for having faith in SAM in the early days, when most companies virtually ignored it. Phil Glover. From owner-sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Wed Jun 30 08:58:30 1999 Message-ID: <19990630075147.71741.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [192.127.94.7] From: Rob Smith To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 00:51:47 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Orcpt: rfc822;sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Reply-To: sam-users@nvg.ntnu.no Status: RO Content-Length: 712 Lines: 19 Hello Sam Users, I recently rediscovered my Spectrum and Sam and have since been transferring Specy games to Sam disc via a Messenger. I have to get rid of quite a few specy game as I have little space to keep them all (although I am keeping a select few). Anyway this brings me to two questions... 1, Is there any software that will allow me to compress the messenger files on my Sam disc as I can only get 11 games on 1 disc? 2, Does anyone want any Spectrum games? (there are about one hundred)Although I can't afford to post the games so they would have to be collected. Robert Smith ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com